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What credentials do we believe an audio reviewer should possess?

76.167.143.70
Posted on June 21, 2015 at 15:22:13
Bill Bond
Audiophile

Posts: 45
Location: Los Angeles
Joined: June 7, 2015
 On several forums, there seems to be discussion as to what are the criteria/credentials that the typical audiophile/ audio magazine reader would expect of an audio reviewer.

Is the "expert" ( is there really such an animal) reviewer determined by his/her ( are there actually any female reviewers in that biz??? ).... what? (ok, don't get rude here, LOL)
Is it His/Her hearing ability, His/Her experience in listening to multitudes of music, His/Her writing ability and/or His /Her use of prose, His/Her exposure to large amounts of gear, His/Her years in the hobby, His/Her current set-up---- and on and on. What do we think should be the primary criteria for acknowledging that any audio writer is someone that we can put our trust and belief in.Presumably then leading us to seek out the gear in review as part of our purchase decision.

 

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Law Degree [nt], posted on June 21, 2015 at 15:25:19
Todd Krieger
Audiophile

Posts: 37333
Location: SW United States
Joined: November 2, 2000

 

RE: Law Degree [nt], posted on June 21, 2015 at 15:28:31
Bill Bond
Audiophile

Posts: 45
Location: Los Angeles
Joined: June 7, 2015
 That's only for politicos, LOL.

 

A thick skin. . . , posted on June 21, 2015 at 15:46:02
risabet
Audiophile

Posts: 3197
Location: SoCal
Joined: January 10, 2005
 to put up with us audiophiles nitpicking their opinions!




Science is the great antidote to the poison of enthusiasm and superstition.

Adam Smith

 

RE: What credentials do we believe an audio reviewer should possess?, posted on June 21, 2015 at 17:10:11
painter27
Audiophile

Posts: 5057
Location: wi.
Joined: January 7, 2003
 Any review should be done by a group of people (3 to 5 ?) in the same system, in the same environment & each reviewer gives a independent assessment.

Does that ever happen?

 

RE: A thick skin. . . , posted on June 21, 2015 at 17:34:03
RGA
Reviewer

Posts: 15177
Location: Hong Kong
Joined: August 8, 2001
 LOL :)

A Donald Trump Ego also helps.

 

RE: What credentials do we believe an audio reviewer should possess?, posted on June 21, 2015 at 17:47:06
RGA
Reviewer

Posts: 15177
Location: Hong Kong
Joined: August 8, 2001
 Actually yes it does happen - check out UHF Magazine from Canada - they have their small three person panel - and occasionally 1 or 2 more people. There is a review and then final commentary from each person in the "Crosstalk" section.

They only put out about 4 issues per year or something. They have their latest issue for free online (well part of the issue - they put the crosstalk section in French and cover over some pages but it's to give you an idea of it to get subscriptions.

They also don't get a lot of manufacturers giving them stuff because of numerous scathing reviews over the years.

 

RE: What credentials do we believe an audio reviewer should possess?, posted on June 21, 2015 at 17:59:55
Tre'
Industry Professional

Posts: 17305
Location: So. Cal.
Joined: February 9, 2002
 "His/Her experience in listening to multitudes of music"

The full knowledge of the sound of unamplified acoustic instruments is the only true reference we can have.

With amplified instruments, how would we ever know how the knobs are arranged?

Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"

 

Let the market decide ... , posted on June 21, 2015 at 18:30:28
three_sox
 ... Credentials mean nothing to me.

The intangible quality of believability of the reviewer to me as an individual is important.

However I tend not to place much weight on any particular reviewer's opinion. Though I do take more notice of some over others.



 

RE: What credentials do we believe an audio reviewer should possess?, posted on June 21, 2015 at 20:21:09
mkuller
Audiophile

Posts: 38130
Location: SF Bay Area
Joined: April 22, 2003
 ...how can you do a review of a component in a single system?

Are you hearing the component under test or its interaction with that particular system?

Amateurish at best.

A single system review with other reviewers can be part of a review but by its nature cannot tell the whole story.

 

We don't need..., posted on June 21, 2015 at 20:23:56
mkuller
Audiophile

Posts: 38130
Location: SF Bay Area
Joined: April 22, 2003
 ...no stinkin' credentials!

Love of music, experience listening to many different components and the ability to describe what you hear in an entertaining manner are that really matter.

 

RE: What credentials do we believe an audio reviewer should possess?, posted on June 21, 2015 at 20:41:05
Bill the K
Audiophile

Posts: 8386
Joined: June 3, 2006
 She/He should be one of us.

Bill

 

An interest in music., posted on June 21, 2015 at 21:55:50
jusbe
Audiophile

Posts: 5950
Location: North Island
Joined: April 4, 2000
 And an aversion to polemicism. Not looking for a new 'audio priest/priestess' to follow, personally.


Big J

"... only a very few individuals understand as yet that personal salvation is a contradiction in terms."


 

Here I am, I have that and..., posted on June 21, 2015 at 22:27:58
PaulN
Audiophile

Posts: 1412
Joined: January 13, 2000
 an EE. ---Go!

 

RE: Here I am, I have that and..., posted on June 21, 2015 at 22:37:45
Todd Krieger
Audiophile

Posts: 37333
Location: SW United States
Joined: November 2, 2000
 If a reviewer needs "credentials", the only one I can think of is listeners of the reviewed products by and large actually hearing what was stated in his/her reviews.......

 

Disagree, posted on June 21, 2015 at 22:52:13
PaulN
Audiophile

Posts: 1412
Joined: January 13, 2000
 Love of music is base. Understanding of the equipment is paramount. Why? Because if you deign to review equipment, you must understand equipment. Does that take a degree? No. Some of the best designers in high-end history were not engineers. But if you want to be a reviewer, you need the cred, both tech chops and ears or you are just another blowhard... and there are too many of that breed to name, names. Such as HP, J.Scull and Corey what's his name... Oh and the biggest wind of all Mssr. S.Rochlin, who fails as both a reviewer and a journalist because he has nothing but air (lots of air) and opinion to contribute. I appreciate your wine reviews, but your ears mean nothing to me.

 

RE: What credentials do we believe an audio reviewer should possess?, posted on June 21, 2015 at 23:04:20
Disbeliever
Audiophile

Posts: 1877
Joined: June 1, 2012
 The days of believing anything an Audio reviewer says are long long gone.Their personal opinions today are totally useless ,you always have to listen for yourself.You may or may not agree with them.

 

RE: What credentials do we believe an audio reviewer should possess?, posted on June 21, 2015 at 23:31:49
stehno
Manufacturer

Posts: 739
Location: Oregon
Joined: November 8, 2001
 Well trained ears and morals.

I realize that's shootin' for the moon, but we gotta' start somewhere.

 

RE: Let the market decide ... , posted on June 22, 2015 at 00:16:18
Frihed89
Audiophile

Posts: 15703
Location: Copenhagen
Joined: March 21, 2005
 Good answer. I was going to say "experience", which is the same thing.

But come to think of it, the best description of how recorded music sounds comes from an audio friend, whom i trust and whose spoken and written words I can understand fully.

I think these are the people to turn to in times of doubt.

 

Ears that stand up like those of a Doberman Pinscher?, posted on June 22, 2015 at 03:57:25
genungo
 Hearing ability? A reviewer should have "average" hearing ability - not supernaturally good, not worse than average.

Listening experience? Almost goes without saying. If they don't know what music sounds like and/or if they have not listened to and compared many different types of gear in many different situations, then there's little point in trying to write a professional review. That said, if I had to choose between a "gearhead" reviewer and a reviewer who really does know what live music sounds like - I'd surely pick the latter.

Writing ability? Sure.

Current setup? Not a big concern for me (why should it be?).

Honesty, integrity? Cross your fingers and pray.


The most important trait a reviewer can have is a real passion for music and listening. Passionate reviewers will always make sure that they have done their homework but, more importantly, they will know exactly how to connect with like-minded people.

 

At least 20 years experience, posted on June 22, 2015 at 04:47:18
fin1bxn@msn.com
Audiophile

Posts: 2215
Location: new jersey
Joined: November 15, 2005
 Having owned all types of equipment (Meaning spent their own money) and music knowledge.

 

RE: What credentials do we believe an audio reviewer should possess?, posted on June 22, 2015 at 05:17:42
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15524
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Well trained ears and an open mind.

 

RE: "Their personal opinions today are totally useless...", posted on June 22, 2015 at 06:36:58
genungo
 Reviews are here to stay, I think. Consumer reviews, pro reviews - it really does not matter in "the information age". People must read, and luckily, even when published reviews are less than perfectly considered and executed they are rarely "totally useless" as info. Read enough of them (the more the merrier, actually) and the truth will begin to emerge.

 

What we really need ..., posted on June 22, 2015 at 07:11:06
SamA
Audiophile

Posts: 2902
Location: Washington, D.C.
Joined: February 12, 2004
 More reviewers devoting FIVE pages to $28,000 tonearms ... NOT!

 

"Because if you deign to review equipment, you must understand equipment", posted on June 22, 2015 at 07:16:57
E-Stat
Audiophile

Posts: 37666
Joined: May 12, 2000
Contributor
  Since: April 5, 2002
 Hopefully, you get all the good descriptions you need for your enjoyment.

I'm with those who use the equipment, however, to appreciate music.

 

Why not?, posted on June 22, 2015 at 07:28:24
genungo
 Those glamorous "eye candy" cover shots attract attention.

Also, the rich need reviews to read just like anyone else. If I was a manufacturer or a dealer, I'd welcome the chance to sell $28,000 tonearms to the richest 1% - especially if doing so allowed me to keep on selling $2800 tonearms designed for the more typical audiophile consumer.

 

RE: Disagree, posted on June 22, 2015 at 07:55:20
mkuller
Audiophile

Posts: 38130
Location: SF Bay Area
Joined: April 22, 2003
 >I appreciate your wine reviews...>

I don't have to know how to make wine, what brix is or its ph to review it - just like audio equipment.

It is only the end result that matters.

HP did more to further observational audio reviewing than anyone else, IMO, using new terms to describe what he heard that audiophiles take for granted today.

To each his own.

Who are your favorite reviewers? Is Julian Hirsch among them?

 

RE: Why not?, posted on June 22, 2015 at 09:07:54
SamA
Audiophile

Posts: 2902
Location: Washington, D.C.
Joined: February 12, 2004
 I can't imagine anyone spending $28,000 on a tone arm. I don't even know anyone who's spent $2,800 on a tone arm. But the numbers are intriguing. If just 1 percent of Stereophile's subscribers (72,159 June 2013) bought an SAT at $28,000, that would represent revenue of $2.02 million. If the other 99 percent spent $2800 on a tone arm, that would be only $2 million.

But why is my subscription subsidizing a "review" for something I or 99 percent of the reader base would never buy?

I just wish reviewers used more common sense when picking products to review - and take serious the responsibility to question all attributes of product - including the pricing.

Maybe a zeolot like Michael Fremer could even ask what's making the slew of re-issue LPs so expensive. Maybe why something like Art Blakey & The Jazz Messengers The Big Beat is listed for something north of $34 an LP.

 

It mostly seems that common sense and the audiophile hobby will..., posted on June 22, 2015 at 09:29:58
musetap
Audiophile

Posts: 31879
Location: San Francisco
Joined: July 8, 2003
Contributor
  Since: January 28, 2004
 never achieve absolute polarity.

And the closer you get to HEA the more phase shift you get between the two.

What continues to make each next batch of LPs so expensive?

They sell. With many titles, production can't keep up with demand.

Dollars drive this business just like any other, no matter what percentage they are aiming for.

Why would MF question it? When was the last time HE had to buy a new LP release?

(And he's a nice guy and buys used LPs, but that's a separate issue)

It'd be grand if reviewer's took a bit more responsibility in their approach but that doesn't seem likely to happen.

"Once this was all Black Plasma and Imagination"-Michael McClure




 

RE: Why?, posted on June 22, 2015 at 11:01:37
genungo
 I certainly can't imagine buying them either, but there's no reason why uber-expensive components shouldn't be there for those who can afford them.

I think that the ultra high-end stuff is (was?) made mostly to show the world what the manufacturer can do when all cost restraints are removed. "High-end" helps generate excitement. It helps in research and development. It helps create "trickle-down" technology that, in turn, often helps improve performance in a company's more affordable designs.

Other theories about the relative importance of ultra high-end audio also exist. One such theory proposes that the rise of "ultra high-end" audio is evidence that audio manufacturers have been feeling more and more desperate, perhaps literally breathing their last dying gasps of air in a marketplace that is moving away from traditional hifi playback.

 

RE: What credentials do we believe an audio reviewer should possess?, posted on June 22, 2015 at 12:46:13
A.Wayne
Audiophile

Posts: 2527
Location: Front row center
Joined: November 30, 2011



Dats easy , good ears ........

 

RE: Here I am, I have that and..., posted on June 22, 2015 at 12:50:13
wangmr
Audiophile

Posts: 2410
Location: Downtown
Joined: November 29, 2012
 you mean there are reviewers that write what is not heard?

roger wang

 

RE: Disagree, posted on June 22, 2015 at 15:32:56
PaulN
Audiophile

Posts: 1412
Joined: January 13, 2000
 Using wine is a false premise. Wine is not a conduit for another experience, it is an end unto itself unless you want to argue that a bunch of aromatic alkyls are like music. Stating that it is only the end result that matters is actually not true for a great many audiophiles for whom the journey is the goal. HP was influential, but I'm not certain actually good for audio, and his sort of bombast has done nothing but alienate a whole generation of potential enthusiasts with over-the-top writing about minute differences spelt out with florid prose nobody actually enjoys reading except the author.

While the Hirsch snark is old and tired, it really isn't relevant anymore since only the old and fat even remember. For my taste I sincerely appreciate what JA has brought to the table, inspired by the writers from HFN&RR and perhaps Audio, a hifi magazine borne of engineers and thoughfully offering measurements as well as use reports . I very much appreciated Bascom King's reviews and the occasional nerdy humor. I no longer have much respect for the purely subjective reviewers, finding them twee, self-congratulatory and frequently prickish.

 

unemployed, posted on June 22, 2015 at 16:32:27
lokie
Audiophile

Posts: 1989
Location: Georgia, USA
Joined: January 28, 2003
 There isn't a single reviewer that I pay attention to. The only people's opinion that mean anything to me regarding gear are fellow audiophiles with similar taste than mine.

People in "the business" have an agenda that are based on a bunch of things that don't have anything to do with my system. Audiophile acquaintances/ friends opinions that have earned my trust over the years is the only source that may get me to try something new.

Every once in a while when I read a review and read words like "astonished" and "blown away" it makes me think they are idiots... but not as big of an idiot as the people that believe them.

 

"The Acutance of Kodachrome", posted on June 22, 2015 at 16:42:21
Des
Audiophile

Posts: 2110
Location: Great Barrier Reef
Joined: August 3, 2000
Contributor
  Since: August 2, 2000
One of HP's Fav assimilations --I always like that one

Des

 

Can you run for president? You'd get my vote!, posted on June 22, 2015 at 22:08:37
Raiderman
Audiophile

Posts: 2129
Location: Silicon Valley, California
Joined: March 14, 2003
 Although you might be too intelligent for the position.
(So, you might need a frontal lobotomy like the last few presidents appear to have had.)
:-)

 

Certainly not what Peter B. has been displaying of late, posted on June 23, 2015 at 02:44:11
morricab
Distributor or Rep

Posts: 9181
Location: switzerland
Joined: April 1, 2005
 nt.

 

Do you mean a..., posted on June 23, 2015 at 08:09:31
Inmate51
 professional "does-it-for-a-living" reviewer, or a part-timer? I ask because it seems obvious that there are a lot of part-timers who pay their mortgage and other bills and taxes with the proverbial "day job".

I suspect that most reviewers have never taken a single course in acoustics, psychoacoustics, physics (beyond high school), or any other related area, nor are they musicians who ever played an instrument beyond the high school level, yet they portray and promote themselves as people whom we should hold in high regard for their knowledge of sound, hearing and the equipment we use to produce and reproduce sound, and the rooms in which we listen. I don't have anything against their voicing their opinion, but, as far as I'm concerned, it's just another opinion.

This is one reason why I pay little attention to reviewers in general.

:)

 

RE: Do you mean a..., posted on June 23, 2015 at 21:01:40
Bill Bond
Audiophile

Posts: 45
Location: Los Angeles
Joined: June 7, 2015
 It would appear from King Peter Breuninger's post at the other forum that he has decided to remove himself from further ridicule. Although his OP over there would certainly insure a long lasting pushback, LOL. King Peter proceeded to fall on his sword...which he should have done after his first inane thread. However, I do think the fact that he committed kamikaze is not a bad idea, particularly since questions about his credentials hadn't really surfaced yet.

 

RE: Do you mean a..., posted on June 26, 2015 at 09:19:01
Bill Bond
Audiophile

Posts: 45
Location: Los Angeles
Joined: June 7, 2015
 At the other forum, we have a 'self appointed' expert reviewer start a thread about Harman methods of scientific analysis and testing results vs. his listening expertise. The thread is here:
http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?17978-Objectivists-Harman-Testing-Reviewers-and-Reality
I bring this to light as it is an excellent example of a 'reviewer' postulating about audio with seemingly no real experience or credential, yet when confronted by members who are interested in finding out more about the science and engineering behind gear--what does he do, well read the thread! For my part, I would never take any heed in what this guy writes as a review given his stance...pathetic.

 

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