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REVIEW: Carver CT-17 Preamplifier (SS)

75.48.6.140
Posted on March 22, 2015 at 18:01:23
FRG7SWL
Audiophile

Posts: 2109
Location: NorCali
Joined: March 26, 2003
Model: CT-17
Category: Preamplifier (SS)
Suggested Retail Price: $200 used
Description: Pre-Amp/Tuner, with Dolby Pro Logic Surround & Sonic Holography
Manufacturer URL: Carver
Model Picture: View

Review by FRG7SWL on March 22, 2015 at 18:01:23
IP Address: 75.48.6.140		Add Your Review
for the CT-17

It's hard to believe Carver's CT-17 was their second most expensive preamp ($799 retail; C-19 was $999 retail, per Audio magazine's October 1990 33rd Annual Equipment Directory), considering the critical bashing it's endured these last several decades. Which is understandable, because as a stand alone preamp it's fairly neutral yet sonically un-inspiring. However, add an equalizer or sonic processor of choice through its' External Processor Loop, & CT-17s morph into extremely expressive tonal templates. Way back-in-the-day, techs modified gear to personalize it to their specific needs. So Bob Carver the tech apparently crafted an external loop for BBE-n-dbx-n-Dolby et al fanatics to explore their muses through. Relative neutrality, in comparison, really is boring. ... Another interesting CT-17 aspect are the video/audio inputs, which apparently have a different eq curve than either aux, cd, or tape monitor modes. Noticed similar aural anomaly on Carver MXR-130 Receiver's video/audio input, which was replicated from C-1 preamp. ... Although phono preamp complemented Shure V-15 Type IV cartridges quite nicely, moi still preferred Mitsubishi DA-C20's phono preamp. Which shines gloriously through Video 2 audio feed. Whilst C-17 phono preamp elicits hi-fi presentation from Sony ICF-2010. ... Surround Modes are fun to experiment with. Engage Dolby Pro Logic, & surround thyself in nostalgic 90s noir. You'll need the remote control, though, to access all Dolby parameters. In Hall mode, you can enjoy ambiance from Abbey Road to Fillmore East to CBGB to Yoshi's. Simulated Stereo mode gives mono mixes a quirky twist. Turn Surround Mode off, & enjoy external equalizer or processor of choice exclusively. With all three tone controls dimed, it's guilty pleasure in harmonic heaven. Just like with MXR-130, Loudness Contour needn't be engaged. ... Both A.M. & F.M. tuner sections harken back to those daze when radio still reigned supreme (although home theatre was starting to make inroads). Recently read on Carver site that original TX-11 tuner, which was included in MXR-130, was designed to replicate Marantz 10B tuner. CT-17's audio in both A.M. & F.M. mode is cleaner-n-clearer than MXR-130's, whose topology was half-a-decade older. F.M. sensitivity-n-selectivity is bettered only by Sony's now extremely collectable XDR-F1HD (CT-17's F.M. selectivity could benefit from I.F. filter mod for those brave souls with steady hands & eagle eye sight). A.M. reception requires A.M. loop antenna, as end-fed straight wire will cause front end overload. Fidelity is exemplary, akin to early 70s Marantz or Realistic receivers. ... Oh yeah, there's Remote Amplifier Output. Which is a second independent preamplifier. Only without tone control access. Damn near perfect for a straight-wire-with-gain aficionado. There's also Rear Surround Channel outputs for proper Dolby Surround, along with a Center Surround output for dialog and/or subwoofer presentation. CT-17s run unusually hot for preamps, so provide adequate ventilation. ... Carver's CT-17 probably wasn't meant to appease cork sniffers. Especially in stock mode. But add a BBE Sonic Maximizer, dbx expander, Dolby outboard processor, or equalizer or processor of choice through External Processor loop, & you'll have a fairly robust control center for auld skool audio & video presentation. ... Rolling Stone had an ancillary publication in 1982 called The Record. Chip Stern wrote an audio column about "Hi-Fi Without Fear: The Weakest Link" in the July '82 edition. Wherein a friend-of-a-friend's dad had spent $80 Grand on a super stereo system, which included Infinity Reference Monitors. Instead of being blown away, he was bummed because he heard limitations inherent in the medium being played. Which back then were tape-n-vinyl. With a decent outboard processor, a similar scenario is possible via CT-17. For roughly $79,000 less!!! ... 73s para Sactown

Product Weakness: Needs External Dynamic Expander or Equalizer in External Processor Loop for exemplary performance; F.M. Tuner could benefit from I.F. filter mod; Remote Control a necessity; Runs rather hot for preamp, so provide adequate ventilation
Product Strengths: Commendable AM/FM Reception; Dolby Digital for auld-skool home theatre presentation; Sonic Holography enhances Hafler Surround Sound Experience; Hall Ambiance Enhancement for Abbey Road to CBGB to Yohsi replication; Simulated Stereo Enhancement for quirky mono mixes; Second pre-amp accessible via Remote Amp Output

Associated Equipment for this Review:

Amplifier: Carver MXR-130
Preamplifier (or None if Integrated): Mitsubishi DA-C20
Sources (CDP/Turntable): Denon DCM-450; Dual 504
Speakers: Mesa/Celestion Black Shadows
Cables/Interconnects: Calrad
Music Used (Genre/Selections): Blues, Boogie, Classical, Jazz, R & B, Rock, Bop to Pop to Hip Hop & Beyond
Type of Audition/Review: Product Owner

 

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RE: REVIEW: Carver CT-17 Preamplifier (SS), posted on March 22, 2015 at 18:03:38
AudioSoul
Audiophile

Posts: 4594
Location: north central AZ
Joined: July 9, 2005

Shouldn't this be in amp/preamp asylum?

 

And you heard that though guitar speakers? (NT), posted on March 22, 2015 at 20:59:02
Stale
Audiophile

Posts: 3263
Location: So. California
Joined: August 3, 2001


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite insane."

 

RE: Hemp Reconed Mesa/Celestion MC 90s ..., posted on March 22, 2015 at 21:50:04
FRG7SWL
Audiophile

Posts: 2109
Location: NorCali
Joined: March 26, 2003
 ... to be specific, Stale, which make excellent P.A. speakers, too! Brown Soun's crew treats this retired printer like rock royalty. They also reconed a pair of Utility Advents, which are still rockin' strong a decade later. Late owner John Harrison said he also had several requests for hemp-reconed Celestion V 30s, which were used for hi-fi applications. Recipients said they delivered the best mid-range their multi-kilo-buck gear ever replicated. Remember, Celestion's fabled Alnico Blue was originally designed for radio duty. As were several now classique Jensens. Lynn Olson once tested a 12" Tone Tubby Alnico driver in full range configuration, & found "... it sounds really good. Hemp does something you don't see in the exotic carbon-fiber, Kevlar, metals, or this-n-thatium exotics; it doesn't break up. No cone cry, no raspy breakup, no hashy grating sound at high frequencies or at high levels".

 

RE: REVIEW: Carver CT-17 Preamplifier (SS), posted on March 23, 2015 at 04:47:17
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Thanks! for sharing. W/ so many of his products back then, Bob Carver was way ahead of his time.

 

Hmmmm, posted on March 23, 2015 at 10:08:30
Stale
Audiophile

Posts: 3263
Location: So. California
Joined: August 3, 2001
 I prefer speakers that have other parts of the spectrum than midrange. If you enjoy it, good for you.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite insane."

 

RE: Mmmmm, posted on March 23, 2015 at 10:58:53
FRG7SWL
Audiophile

Posts: 2109
Location: NorCali
Joined: March 26, 2003
 No prob! Hemp cones specialize in replicating serious bass too, complementing their killer midrange. MC-90s, which were originally badged G12H-80s back-in-da-daze, are Celestion's take on Electro Voice's seamless bass-to-midrange tonal transition. Even Jensen's new-generation 10" Jet Falcons have impressive bump-to-the-thump factor for their size!!!

 

Almost 100% Wrong About Everything, posted on March 24, 2015 at 11:36:44
Mike Porper
Audiophile

Posts: 1414
Location: Chicago
Joined: December 28, 2009
 >>It's hard to believe Carver's CT-17 was their second most expensive preamp ($799 retail; C-19 was $999 retail, per Audio magazine's October 1990 33rd Annual Equipment Directory), considering the critical bashing it's endured these last several decades.<<

Really? It's been "bashed", for....decades? It wasn't even in prodcution that long. But, you're saying that apparently the critics, audio critics allegedly, just kept piling on the poor pre-amp, over and over and over and over...for decades? Wow.

>>Way back-in-the-day, techs modified gear to personalize it to their specific needs.<<

What? Who did that? I've never heard of techs "personalizing" audio equipment. You seem to have mixed up 2015 with 1985. Are you thinking of ring tones and screen savers, and projecting that backwards to old gear? Mods were made by various "gurus" with the promise of improving the item in terms of transparency, preservation of harmonic delicacy, tonal purity, soundstaging, and so on. What you seem to desire is the opposite of that.

>>So Bob Carver the tech apparently crafted an external loop for BBE-n-dbx-n-Dolby et al fanatics to explore their muses through.<<

WRONG. External processing loops were common place on pre-amplifiers, and some more expensive receivers. They were included so that devices such as equalizers, etc. could be added to the system...if desired. They weren't added for fanatics of any stripe, as you seem to think.

BTW, over the years, there've been many features that've appeared on pre-amps, such as stereo blend, muting, ultra-sonic filters, tone control frequency turnover, etc. All of them were designed on solid engineering ground, with the thought of adding benefits that would help improve sonic performance, not for fanatics who desire to add wild electronic gadgets to goose up to sound to even greater levels of electronic coloration.

For audiophiles, all such controls bring the penalty of electronic coloration and degradation of the signal. The idea is that the less circuitry through which the signal passes, the better. That's why high end pre-amps tend to have fewer, rather than greater, switches.

>>Relative neutrality, in comparison, really is boring. ...<<

Sure is, if you're reference is some wildly EQ'd, booming, pounding, ultra-zingy-bright car stereo system. Or, the brutal thumpers at the dance club, as you pour down the alcohol in time to the EDM beat.

>>Another interesting CT-17 aspect are the video/audio inputs, which apparently have a different eq curve than either aux, cd, or tape monitor modes. <<

That would be an anamoly. All inputs should be flat. No eq curves added. Otherwise, the listener's stuck with some wacked-out EQ that he/she doesn't want or need.

>>add a BBE Sonic Maximizer, dbx expander, Dolby outboard processor, or equalizer or processor of choice through External Processor loop<<

You're the exact opposite of an audiophile. You demand more electronic coloration, more electronic processing, more synthetic, unnatural noise.

Audiophiles want zero of all of that. I wouldn't have any of the devices you've mentioned anywhere near my house. Why? Because I'm a "cork sniffer" as you've put it? No. Because I find the sound of real musical instruments playing in a real space thrilling to the core. You seem to have trouble really getting that. Grasping the concept. Let's see if I can explain it this way. Some guys like women with fake breasts. The phonier, the faker, the better they like it. Other guys prefer real women, without silicone. The latter aren't "cork sniffers". Does that make it any clearer?

In the end, you're free to enjoy whatever you like. But, don't make stuff up, or misappropriate terminology.

 

RE: Almost 100% Wrong About Everything???, posted on March 24, 2015 at 13:23:03
FRG7SWL
Audiophile

Posts: 2109
Location: NorCali
Joined: March 26, 2003
 Hardly so, baby bubba! Learned electronics from quite a few tech sarges whilst still impressionable Air Force brat! Fisher was preferred gear (along with Hammerlund short wave receivers), because Marantz-n-Macintosh was deemed for officers. They were always tweaking topologies to suit personal tonal taste! As such, was raised loud-n-proud sizzlin' boomer; which has been noted quite a few times on A.A. Their theory was hi fi was supposed to be fun, for gyratin' glutes moreso than for contemplative reflection. Unless you were listening to Coltrane-n-Miles! Am more audio hobbyist than audiophile, anyhoo! With smidgen of guitarist mentality thrown into mix! Personalization via external loops applies to all gear, BTW. Can't imagine rockin' Mesa Mark I without utilizin' external loop. Aint dissin' "cork sniffers", just sayin' CT-17s won't float their boat. BTW, thanks for inclusively dissin' women who've had breast augmentation following mastectomies!!!

 

RE: Mmmmm, posted on March 26, 2015 at 11:22:19
Stale
Audiophile

Posts: 3263
Location: So. California
Joined: August 3, 2001
 As I said, if you enjoy them, good for you.
But don't try to convince anyone that high sensitivity pro guitar speaker can provide significant bass. Even the link you provided shows drop starting at about 300Hz. You may get some upper bass, but not bass. Do not even want to talk about the sound with practically nothing above 5kHz.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite insane."

 

RE: Mmmmm, posted on March 26, 2015 at 15:03:34
FRG7SWL
Audiophile

Posts: 2109
Location: NorCali
Joined: March 26, 2003
 Like Rachel Lou-n-Bekka Lou continually exclaim, What-Ever!!!

 

RE: Hemp Reconed Mesa/Celestion MC 90s ..., posted on March 27, 2015 at 04:59:12
beppe61
Audiophile

Posts: 4705
Joined: January 29, 2004


Hi i think that this is a very interesting topic
From the graph this very remarkable driver gives the opportunity to cover all the midrange with just a single driver, avoiding a need of x-over just in the middle.
But it is more a topic for the Speaker Asylum i think.
Thanks for the information.
Kind regards,
bg

 

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