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Subwoofer Cables

125.237.76.7
Posted on August 17, 2015 at 08:46:00
frequentflyer
Audiophile

Posts: 152
Location: New Zealand
Joined: July 1, 2003
 Hi

Because my integrated amplifier does not have enough output from the pre-amp stage I am having to run my sub-woofers from the high level terminals the same ones as I drive my main speakers from.

I am using quite expensive cables for my main speakers so my questions are

Would I be wasting money using the same cables level of cables for the sub?

Can anyone recommend high end speaker cables that are tailored to drive a powered sub woofer

Thanks
FF

 

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RE: Subwoofer Cables, posted on August 17, 2015 at 10:22:51
mt10425
Audiophile

Posts: 2399
Location: 3 hours west of Chicago
Joined: January 23, 2004
 It's a waste of money. Use quality 12ga wire with quality connectors. It's only to send a signal to the sub amp. I use 5 subs (3 in ht and two stereo). I have one pre-out connection and the rest are parallel (speaker taps). I've toyed with different cables for this application and found little difference once the gauge was sufficientl.



"It's all fun and games until someone doesn't pick up on the sarcasm"

 

RE: Subwoofer Cables, posted on August 17, 2015 at 14:56:20
Duster
Manufacturer

Posts: 17117
Location: Pacific Northwest
Joined: August 25, 2002
 The best approach is to consider the nature of the REL subwoofer cable, and the various aftermarket for REL subwoofer cables to get an idea of what's involved in designing an appropriate high-level/speaker-level subwoofer interconnect. You will find aspects of both speaker cable and line-level interconnect design criteria. Quality of the conductor, insulation, geometry, are just as important, so consider such in the same manner as you would any other audio cable. That said, a high-level subwoofer cable does not require as much material to build as a large gauge speaker cable intended for loudspeaker applications tends to be, so a less expensive option is possible vs. that of your main loudspeakers. That said, mundane zip cord with PVC insulation will make sound, but a more sophisticated cable should be implemented for a serious application.

IME, when used for a high-level/speaker-level subwoofer cable, cheap speaker wire and any cable for that matter will impart its own sonic signature upon the presentation, so don't expect any wire will do, but current requirements are so minimal, a large aggregate gauge speaker cable that's designed for passive loudspeakers is unnecessary. The nature of a speaker-level subwoofer interconnect lies somewhere between a speaker cable and a line-level interconnect. Voltage drop may be an issue to address, so IMHO the aggregate gauge should follow the same rule as typical simple speaker wire advice (see online charts for minimum-gauge recommendations). 16 AWG aggregate gauge should suffice for most applications unless a very long length is involved. RFI and EMI issues are even more important to avoid than a speaker cable for a passive loudspeaker application, so look for cable geometries that offer noise rejection without the use of braided and/or foil shielding, IMO.

What are you using for the application, at this time?

 

RE: Subwoofer Cables, posted on August 17, 2015 at 15:48:25
danlaudionut
Audiophile

Posts: 5480
Location: Schenectady
Joined: June 6, 2002
 I use these and they work great.
Basic silver with teflon insulation.
I would never try them on full range.

DanL



 

RE: Subwoofer Cables, posted on August 17, 2015 at 16:18:45
frequentflyer
Audiophile

Posts: 152
Location: New Zealand
Joined: July 1, 2003
 Hi Duster

Thanks for the very informative response.

To answer your question up until recently I have been using Combak Harmonix HS-101 SLC cables on both the sub and main speakers.

I have now changed my main speaker cables to High Fidelity CT-1 along with IC's so you may appreciate why I am now asking for advice regards the sub cable.

Your help is really appreciated

Cheers
FF

 

RE: Subwoofer Cables, posted on August 17, 2015 at 16:51:13
Duster
Manufacturer

Posts: 17117
Location: Pacific Northwest
Joined: August 25, 2002
 From what I gather, the Combak Harmonix HS-101 SLC might be one of the few shielded speaker cables suitable for use as a speaker-level subwoofer cable. I would evaluate how dynamic the bass may sound via the cables in order to hear how the shielding might affect that aspect. However, it seems to be a stellar design, so the shielding might perhaps offer very high high-performance for the particular application. But that's just postulation on my part. Also, remember that a well-articulated bottom end is not the only listening cue to be aware of, since the soundstage including spatial cues and ambient information can be greatly affected by cables that don't get in the way of portraying accurate phase characteristics, from top to bottom.

 

RE: Subwoofer Cables, posted on August 18, 2015 at 13:00:01
frequentflyer
Audiophile

Posts: 152
Location: New Zealand
Joined: July 1, 2003
 Hi

Thanks for the feedback.

Just a couple of questions

What cables did you try?

How revealing is the system you tried them in?

Thanks
FF

 

RE: Subwoofer Cables, posted on August 18, 2015 at 14:28:44
mt10425
Audiophile

Posts: 2399
Location: 3 hours west of Chicago
Joined: January 23, 2004
 My HT has Tannoy speakers with a Marantz AVR (subs for center, surrounds and LFE). My two channel setup is tube-based, linear TT and Fostex full-range speakers (dual subs). Sub cables include: Vampire CCC, Auvio, Monster 16/4 in-wall, and a 12/4 DIY and others I don't remember. Except for the center channel sub cable, the others are, at least, 15 ft long. I hope this helps.



"It's all fun and games until someone doesn't pick up on the sarcasm"

 

RE: Subwoofer Cables, posted on August 19, 2015 at 14:03:12
frequentflyer
Audiophile

Posts: 152
Location: New Zealand
Joined: July 1, 2003
 Hi

Thanks for that.

I just had another thought.

If the main speaker cables transmit signal very fast and in the case of the High Fidelity they do, and I know speed varies from different cables would the sub-cable not need to transmit at the same speed or am I way off track?

Cheers

 

RE: Subwoofer Cables, posted on August 19, 2015 at 15:00:54
Duster
Manufacturer

Posts: 17117
Location: Pacific Northwest
Joined: August 25, 2002
 Transient response is very critical for bass articulation, so cables implemented for a subwoofer application should involve a high performance design rather than 12 AWG stranded zip cord with PVC insulation which tends to present woolly bass, with poor dynamic contrast vs. more sophisticated designs.

 

RE: Subwoofer Cables, posted on August 19, 2015 at 18:15:44
Duster
Manufacturer

Posts: 17117
Location: Pacific Northwest
Joined: August 25, 2002
 Hi mt10425,

I know you like Wireworld Luna 16/4 speaker cable. You might consider using that make/model cable as a high-level/speaker-level subwoofer interconnect. It's designed like Wireworld's line-level interconnects, including solid core ribbon conductors, but with larger aggregate gauge conductors better suited for the application. The geometry of the cable offers offers noise reduction, and the 16/4 conductor (2 x 16 AWG conductors per-pole) design is good for the application.

Cheers, Duster

 

RE: Subwoofer Cables, posted on August 20, 2015 at 14:05:43
mt10425
Audiophile

Posts: 2399
Location: 3 hours west of Chicago
Joined: January 23, 2004
 Thanks for the input. I've become a real fanboy of Wireworld cables. Things sound good now. If I get the bug and finances allow, I might go that route. With the distances I have, things have to fall into place.



"It's all fun and games until someone doesn't pick up on the sarcasm"

 

RE: Subwoofer Cables, posted on August 20, 2015 at 14:35:17
mt10425
Audiophile

Posts: 2399
Location: 3 hours west of Chicago
Joined: January 23, 2004
 Although I find limited improvement with some parallel cable connections, I will say that the most significant changes happened with P/Cs. I've used Shunyata and other aftermarket cords. I've also heard some expensive cords on 100,000 systems and there is a noticeable difference.



"It's all fun and games until someone doesn't pick up on the sarcasm"

 

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