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XLR VS RCA

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Posted on January 31, 2015 at 04:10:30
thebordas
 From a purist standpoint, is there any consensus on the virtues of using a balanced interconnect rather than an RCA cable from the same manufacturer? I have Krell gear and I understand that balanced should be better but I think I'm hearing more openness with the RCA. I will continue my evaluation but would appreciate any insight you guys and gals may have to offer;))

 

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RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on January 31, 2015 at 05:19:52
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Dave- I like RCA on Conrad Johnson gear. I enjoy XLR on ARC or Ayre gear.
I believe certain brand(s) do well w/ one vs. the other. If you own some of the newer Krell gear, XLR would probably be better.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on January 31, 2015 at 05:28:54
thebordas
 I am trying an MIT ORACLE Proline vs MIT ORACLE RCA this week...I will A/B them and trim volume for gain difference. Just wondering if the xtra circuitry defeats the potential benefits? I WILL FIND THE TRUTH!

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on January 31, 2015 at 06:35:00
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 I am looking forward to reading your impressions Dave.
Are you using entry, mid or high-level MIT cables./cords?

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on January 31, 2015 at 06:38:40
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Second note;
I do prefer Audience cables/cords on C-J gear. Whereas, I enjoy Transparent on Ayre/ARC gear. I think that Pass Labs gear sounds best w/ Silent Source cables/cords (a cheaper option would be Signal Cable).

The new Wireworld Electra 7 power cord is excellent as well.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on January 31, 2015 at 06:45:42
thebordas
 Mixed overall with MIT ORACLE AC2 on Krell Vanguard, a Transparent PLMM2 on my Krell 505, Transparent Ultra Gen 5 Biwires and MIT ORACLE V1.2 Prolines for IC's. Both plugged into a Wattgat IEC WT Transparent power conditioning duplex module. Speakers are B&W
802D's. Hifi tuning fuses installed in 505!

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on January 31, 2015 at 06:49:15
thebordas
 I also forgot to mention I am comparing my V1.2 Prolines to the Oracle MA-X RCA's;)

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on January 31, 2015 at 06:50:28
thebordas
 All great choices...too many sometimes:()

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on January 31, 2015 at 09:07:55
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Brilliant!
I must say, the very best PC (for me), is still a Stage III Concepts.
However, I have not had the pleasure of auditioning it w/ Transparent, Silent Source, Audience nor Wireworld.

The system, in which, I did hear it was a Cardas.

Additionally, I have always wanted to demo Kubala, Enklein, Elrod, Tellurium, Skogard...etc., yes -too many but, this is never a bad thing...

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on January 31, 2015 at 09:08:51
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 I know that Krell 505 is sweet!

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on January 31, 2015 at 09:09:30
thebordas
 Just bad for my wallet and marriage;))

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on January 31, 2015 at 09:09:47
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Do you have all of these MIT models on-hand?
are you borrowing them from a dealer/retailer?

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on January 31, 2015 at 09:10:54
thebordas
 Yeah, I got it updated and the transport works flawlessly:).

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on January 31, 2015 at 09:11:52
thebordas
 Only the MA-X is on loan

 

'from a purist standpoint' does not compute, posted on January 31, 2015 at 09:47:48
Nuit
 From a purely electrical connection? Then balanced is superior
From a purely subjective? Then what sounds best to YOUR ear.

 

RE: 'from a purist standpoint' does not compute, posted on January 31, 2015 at 10:02:00
thebordas
 Where is JR when you need him? If I understand you correctly through your less than subtle jabs at anyone who doesn't walk and talk like you...I should listen and decide for myself, preferably using cables made from recycled scraps of metal and Home Depot wire? Maybe I'm wrong, but you are oozing arrogance and bias out your fingertips!

By purist I meant "Simplest circuit path"

 

RE: XLR VS RCA (my experience), posted on January 31, 2015 at 10:57:37
robss
Audiophile

Posts: 146
Location: PNW
Joined: April 10, 2008
 Not sure I will help directly answer your inquiries but I note with my Simaudio Evolution 600i integrated amp. and SuperNova CD player that the use of XLR/balanced is superior to the RCA when using Shunyata (Zitron) Python ICs. The Simaudio is said to be true dual-mono, and is optimized for the same. While I have not measured any FR response, my ears tell me that the amount of resolution is increased and the tonality is remarkably fuller with "balanced"; there is no question about it. I have not used any other brands of cables, however, so am limited in that respect.

I would welcome the chance to listen to the likes of MIT with my set up but do not have a local dealer I am aware of.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA (my experience), posted on January 31, 2015 at 12:00:59
thebordas
 The Sim stuff is fully dual mono so I'm not surprised at your results. I'll post results next week. I can hook you up with a guy who can usually get some MIT for trial...if serious of course;))

 

RE: XLR VS RCA (my experience), posted on January 31, 2015 at 12:09:23
PingPing
Audiophile

Posts: 196
Joined: May 22, 2014
 IMO, there is no real benefit of using XLR ICs, unless you require 10m long ICs or your components do not have RCA sockets.

For me it depends on the RCA or XLR electronics and the quality of the RCA or XLR ICs not whether it is RCA or XLR, which is how I hear it.

With RCA ICs, if the noise is well controlled then RCAs can/should sound better than XLR ICs. In many instances though noise is not well controlled but noise is well controlled then RCA ICs can/should sound better :)

Unfortunately, XLR electronics remove 2nd order harmonics as part of the XLR noise filtering/cancelling process, which our ears like, but leaves the 3rd order harmonics in place including the noise, which our ears do not like... :)

Even more so, if the Hot and Cold XLR electronics is not well matched then the noise filtering/cancelling process can be even stronger where even more 2nd, and even 3rd, order harmonics are removed. I guess that will provide a smoother, maybe warmer, sound :)

 

RE: XLR VS RCA (my experience), posted on January 31, 2015 at 12:35:37
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Audience cables/cords are a sonic match for Sim gear.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA (my experience), posted on January 31, 2015 at 12:38:48
thebordas
 Now that is some useful stuff....you deserve an AA SPECIAL REWARD! All I have offer is my thanks however;(. I think maybe it's the 2nd order harmonic removal that I'm noticing!! Will give the cables a thorough run through;))

 

RE: XLR VS RCA (my experience), posted on January 31, 2015 at 12:47:27
thebordas
 I believe you;))

 

oozing arrogance and bias? yes I am a stuck up prig. No problem.. that fact has zero to do with my answer., posted on January 31, 2015 at 13:21:19
Nuit
 It is true I am selfish, self important stuck up little prig.
Then we have sensitive touchy feelie types who think it is all about them too. Who seem to need to make a Federal Case out of every comment.
Maybe it is not all about you. maybe I just am an a**hole?

 

RE: oozing arrogance and bias? yes I am a stuck up prig. No problem.. that fact has zero to do with my answer., posted on January 31, 2015 at 14:24:37
thebordas
 Some posters are helpful.....then there is you:( Take your medication and get some rest...I'm sure everything is gonna be ok for you.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA (my experience), posted on January 31, 2015 at 14:33:29
pictureguy
Audiophile

Posts: 22597
Location: SoCal
Joined: October 19, 2008
 How is dual mono and balanced related?
Can something be dual mono and NOT balanced?
Can something be balanced and NOT dual mono?
Too much is never enough

 

Some posters are helpful. Then there is YOU. Really you seriously need to LOOK IN A MIRROR. No kidding. nt, posted on January 31, 2015 at 14:35:23
Nuit
 .

 

RE: Some posters are helpful. Then there is YOU. Really you seriously need to LOOK IN A MIRROR. No kidding. nt, posted on January 31, 2015 at 14:37:13
thebordas
 I took my medication and I feel loads better now...a changed man actually!!

 

RE: XLR VS RCA (my experience), posted on January 31, 2015 at 14:40:03
thebordas
 I believe there is balanced circuitry which is separate from whether or not the equipment design is fully balanced and complementary. You can shove XLR CIRCUITRY into any gear if you wish.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on January 31, 2015 at 14:43:16
thebordas
 Bill Conrad stated that balanced circuitry in home audio gear is a solution looking for a problem:)). May be so true...I will decide the issue this week! At least for me:()

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on January 31, 2015 at 15:25:39
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Dave-
which spinners have you owned prior to the 505?

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on January 31, 2015 at 15:33:44
thebordas
 Levinson 39 and 390s and separate ref gear, Wadia 850, BAT VK-D5, Sony SCD-1 and 3 other ES INCLUDING 5400( stock and Modwright), Oppo(crap), Krell SACD STD, assorted Yamaha older plastic players and the original SONY CD-1:)). Might have been an ARC CD1 in there as well...returned after few months:(.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA (my experience), posted on January 31, 2015 at 16:18:09
pictureguy
Audiophile

Posts: 22597
Location: SoCal
Joined: October 19, 2008
 I got a slightly different impression from some other answer, but YOUR answer is what jives with what I know. My impression is that the ENTIRE DESIGN is a PAIR of circuits operating as PLUS or MINUS each being fed from ONE LEG of the XLR.
The next question would be to address the Sonic Consequences of switching back and forth
Too much is never enough

 

RE: XLR VS RCA (my experience), posted on January 31, 2015 at 17:22:55
thebordas
 Ultimately it's probably best to try and not bias my listening with theory and just let it flow. Over time I will know which sounds better...and that is all that matters!

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on January 31, 2015 at 18:24:15
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Whew, that is a serious list of disc spinners...
which one is your fave?

 

RE: XLR VS RCA (my experience), posted on January 31, 2015 at 18:25:10
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 When it comes down to cables/cords, do not over-think, simply enjoy the music!

 

RE: XLR VS RCA (my experience), posted on January 31, 2015 at 18:30:26
thebordas
 True

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on January 31, 2015 at 18:33:53
thebordas
 My first (39) and my last plus an honorable mention to the 5400 Modwright!

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on January 31, 2015 at 18:35:19
thebordas
 Forgot the Denon Anniversary SACD!

 

RE: XLR VS RCA (my experience), posted on January 31, 2015 at 19:43:21
pictureguy
Audiophile

Posts: 22597
Location: SoCal
Joined: October 19, 2008
 The reason I brought that up was that I WAS CALLED on the balanced / single ended conversion issue.
My DAC outputs either, so I went with balanced.
My OLD integrated was true balanced but my new preamp is NOT. So, using the balanced I convert at the DAC to balanced, and at the preamp, BACK to single ended. Someone brought up the possible sonic consequences.
Just curious as to general opinions.
Too much is never enough

 

RE: XLR VS RCA (my experience), posted on February 1, 2015 at 06:56:59
thebordas
 I have an email into Krell on this issue. Patrick will give me the skinny on this balanced/RCA issue;)

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 1, 2015 at 10:29:34
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Very sweet spinners indeed. I like the ML No. 512 for CD/SACD duty.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 1, 2015 at 10:42:52
thebordas
 The 512 would be the only other player of interest to me.....went with Krell because I went with Krell Integrated. I also got a screaming deal on the 505....and the Vanguard actually:))

 

RE: XLR VS RCA (my experience), posted on February 1, 2015 at 11:22:23
pictureguy
Audiophile

Posts: 22597
Location: SoCal
Joined: October 19, 2008
 I think the answer you might get would go something like this:

For LONG runs, advantage balanced. I don't know HOW long, maybe 12' or 15' UP?
For equipment with REAL balanced design, advantage balanced
Single ended to balanced, and BACK, conversions only potentially damage the sound.

If I understand correctly, a REAL balanced design should have about a 6db edge over the single ended version of the SAME piece.

For systems with NOISE problems, you might want to try balanced, if available.

Since all my runs are short, nothing is native balanced and I have no noise problems, I'm using all single ended, except from my DAC to preamp where I suspect I'm not really helping.
My amps have the additional advantage of a single ended loop OUT / IN so all I need is ONE run to the amp for my biamp setup. Loop in/out is done with a very short (18") single ended run.

Please post the 'official' reply ::
Too much is never enough

 

RE: XLR VS RCA (my experience), posted on February 1, 2015 at 11:51:58
thebordas
 What I'm starting to gather is that balanced does have more circuitry involved, especially true mirror imaged complementary fully balanced designs, which also happen to carry the noise in the signal through the entire circuit until it is cancelled out! Sounds like RCA May have a measurably higher noise/hum but does less harm to the signal in absolute terms. In most cases RCA would be potentially purer sounding with all harmonics intact and the xtra noise below audibility:))

 

RE: XLR VS RCA (my experience), posted on February 1, 2015 at 14:03:03
Ugly
Audiophile

Posts: 2912
Location: Des Moines, WA
Joined: August 22, 2006
 "If I understand correctly, a REAL balanced design should have about a 6db edge over the single ended version of the SAME piece."

This is due to most balanced signals also being differential, ie twice the amplitude. One benefit of impedance balancing is it allows differential noise coupled to the signal lines to appear as a common mode voltage at the receiver input. Receiver circuits of various flavors (such as op amps) are generally designed to reject common mode voltage on their inputs.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 1, 2015 at 14:42:56
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Yes, it is logical to match a pre-amp w/ same brand disc spinner.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA (my experience), posted on February 1, 2015 at 14:44:12
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Nice point- Ugly.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 1, 2015 at 14:58:11
thebordas
 The combo is very compelling and has more of a tube bass and mid quality...reviews should be favorable for the Vanguard. The only competition I've heard is Simaudio for twice the price or more!

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 2, 2015 at 03:27:56
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Agreed-

the Sim gear has really gone up in prices recently?

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 2, 2015 at 04:17:55
thebordas
 Cables arrive today along with some new SACD's...Jazz at the Pawn Shop, Coltrane's Blue Train and C. Adderley's Something Else:)) A review of my Vanguard is out in Hi Fi Critic Magazine....fairly accurate description of what I'm hearing except for the apparent average depth comment. In my system the soundstage is as deep as any I have heard....any deeper and you would lose connection with the music. I hate extreme depth...makes me feel like I need opera glasses and a hearing aid!

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 2, 2015 at 04:21:36
thebordas
 The review is in Hi Fi News....sorry:(

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 2, 2015 at 15:28:16
thebordas
 Talked to Patrick at Krell and he assured me that my Krell components are fully/differentialy balanced! No transformers or such crap in the signal path....definitely superior to the RCA's. So, that seems to jive with what I was hearing today. Even though the MA-X cable is 2 generations newer and $10K retail vs my older Oracle V1.2 Prolines ($6650), my preference is for the 1.2's. The MA-X's give a slightly closer presentation with a smidge less clarity which softens things up too much for my tastes. Sounds a hair veiled in the midrange as well compared to the Prolines. I have a feeling that the XLR pathway has more than a little to do with the sonic degradation I am hearing with the MA-X RCA's. Dynamics and contrast are also slightly better with the Prolines. I am happy with the V1.2 cables and will keep them as my reference interconnects! In my system they provide an open window into the venue while retaining the warmth, dynamics and tone usually diminished by other cables I have used. Perhaps the MA-X Prolines would excell my V1.2's but that cost to benefit ratio would most likely be marginal at best.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 2, 2015 at 17:08:16
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 I read Hi Fi New & Record Review Dave. Which issue has your writings?

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 2, 2015 at 17:09:46
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Excellent SACDs!

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 2, 2015 at 17:10:52
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Patrick is indeed a straight-shooter.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 2, 2015 at 17:15:20
thebordas
 February 2015...Technics Rising on cover!

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 2, 2015 at 17:15:58
thebordas
 Thanks!

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 2, 2015 at 17:19:01
thebordas
 Yes, he went into great detail explaining the balanced circuit...bottom line is that Krell does it right. The Vanguard is more musical and quiet than the S-550i was.....the 550i had serious noise floor problems and hiss and it was also a bit grey sounding.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 3, 2015 at 03:28:34
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Thank You! dave. The FEB issue has not hit my locl news stand yet. As soon as it does I will check it out.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 3, 2015 at 03:29:24
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 This intel is good to know, as, I wanted to demo the 550i model.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 3, 2015 at 03:32:57
thebordas
 My only issue with the HIFI news review is the comments about depth...they were using MP3 layers...REALLY??

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 3, 2015 at 03:43:15
thebordas
 https://durobblog.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/review-krell-vanguard.pdf

Enjoy the review!!

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 3, 2015 at 16:29:22
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Laughing...

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 3, 2015 at 16:29:53
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Thank You! Dave.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 3, 2015 at 16:33:11
thebordas
 Welcome!

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 4, 2015 at 07:00:02
thebordas
 Decided to try the Oracle MA-X Prolines....got a screaming deal on a mint pair:) Balanced should yield superior results...will let you know when I get them!

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 4, 2015 at 10:36:34
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Yes, keep me posted Dave as you break-in these cables/cords. I look forward to your review(s).

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 4, 2015 at 10:55:43
thebordas
 Will do....I have to keep reminding myself that I do NOT have a tube amp!!

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 4, 2015 at 13:29:22
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Dave what reference disc(s) do you use during an audition?

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 4, 2015 at 14:33:28
thebordas
 Some favorites (out of thousands)on my play are:

Gerard Schwarz Seattle Symphony, Shostakovich Sym. No. 11 Koch Swann

Hellhound on my Trail songs by R. Johnson, Telarc

Milt Jackson/Wes Montgomery*Bags meets Wes! Riverside 20bit K2 Super Coding Interface

John Hammond Wicked Grin songs of Tom Waits Poinblank records

Cracow Philharmonic Shosakovich Sym. No. 1 Arabesque Recordings

We Get Requests The Oscae Peterson Trio, Verve 20bit remastered

Boulez Conducts Webern III DG 4D recording

Thelonius Monk Criss-Cross Columbia CBS 24-bit Remastered

Rochberg piano music vol.2 Evan Hirsch pianist Gasparo

Uri Caine Trio Live At The village Vanguard Music Edition Winter and Winter

James McMillan The Worlds Ransoming Cello Concerto BIS World Premier Recording

William Bolcom Violin Concerto Fantasia Concertante Fifth Symphony Argo

Keith Jarrett At The Deer Head inn ECM A local club in the poconos! On a good system you can hear the air conitioner humming and the cars driving by in a light rain outside:))

Many More!!!

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 4, 2015 at 15:01:33
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 A very fine list- Dave.
Add;
Jamie Cullum- Twentysomething CD or SACD (2004) Verve.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 4, 2015 at 15:02:49
thebordas
 I will pick it up!

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 4, 2015 at 15:26:56
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Let me know when you get it, I will point out the best trax.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 7, 2015 at 11:26:54
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Dave-
this am I picked up the FEB issuue of HiFi News.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 7, 2015 at 13:40:39
thebordas
 Cool

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 7, 2015 at 15:15:19
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 which cable did you receive w/ those SACDs ?
how is it settling in your system?

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 7, 2015 at 16:17:26
thebordas
 I demo'd the MA-X and have a pair ordered... should arrive next week! The SACD 's were from Elusive Disc;)

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 7, 2015 at 18:21:13
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Looking forward to your impressions.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 10, 2015 at 14:22:00
thebordas
 Installed the MIT Oracle MA-X Prolines into my system earlier this morning:) For review my system is as follows:

Krell Vanguard Integrated
Krell 505 SACD Player
B&W 802D Speakers
Transparent Ultra Gen 5 Biwire Spkr Cables wt Locking Bananas
Transparent PLMM2 PC
MIT Oracle AC 2 PC
Transparent Power Isolater Duo
and of course my recent addition....The MIT Oracle MA-X Proline Interconnects!!

All I can say is that I weep for anyone not able to own these interconnects. Are they worth $13,200 retail....I think so. Are they worth the 60% off Demo price I paid? OH YEAY!!!

The best way to describe the sound using the MA-X's is that they offer a completely open window into the recording with the most relaxed and utterly detailed presentation possible. They actually hide nothing but sound 100% natural and that goes for the tone color as well. Zero digititus or glare....alarmingly liquid, warm and full of life and texture with excellent dynamics. The system just sounds so uncannily realistic in every important way.....extension, low level detail, warmth, tone color, contrast, soundstaging, quickness and zero fatigue factor at any volume level!! Highly recommended.....the MA-X's are beyond special. They are addictive and they call out to me to play more music:()

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 10, 2015 at 15:48:24
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Very nice- Dave. it is an interesting thing -running both Transparent & MIT cables/cords. Keep me posted as you break-in the MIT!

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 10, 2015 at 16:24:08
thebordas
 Will do....the MIT and Transparent cables work nicely together, giving me a very natural presentation.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 11, 2015 at 15:54:55
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 I look forward to your observations/impressions.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 11, 2015 at 16:47:28
thebordas
 The most striking aspect of the MA -X Prolines is that they play clear and full with completely natural tone. Nothing mechanical or unnatural comes out of them. Ever stand right in front of an alto sax playing ? These cables in my system lay out the complete harmonic envelope from breath to overtones! All I want is to experience being in the presence of music being made...the MA-X cables allow my system to come extremely close to that ideal. Soundstaging is also huge and layered. Unforced and unhyped are additional descriptors I would use to describe the sound. Alive, full of color and dynamics while remaining in control and in balance. Of course the system in total is creating the overall results...but the MA-X cables deliver such complexity so effortlessly and natural that it is quite captivating:)

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 12, 2015 at 09:51:12
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Very nice! Dave.
do you think that you will convert to an all Transparent or all MIT system?

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 12, 2015 at 10:21:52
thebordas
 Been there, done that several times...overall the strengths of MIT come through most in the IC's and Transparent delivers the power and extension I crave with their speaker cables! I like the synergy of each playing to their strengths.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 12, 2015 at 15:46:01
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Awesome reports Dave.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 12, 2015 at 16:18:34
thebordas
 I am debating whether or not to replace the internal fuses on the Vanguard...there are 5 of them so I would think it should be a fairly audible improvement!

 

No, I prefer using RCA inputs and output on my Cary SLP 05 preamp, posted on February 12, 2015 at 17:03:17
Jay Buridan
Audiophile

Posts: 10272
Location: Michigan
Joined: January 21, 2004
 I have listened both ways.

"Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. "
― W.C. Fields

 

RE: No, I prefer using RCA inputs and output on my Cary SLP 05 preamp, posted on February 12, 2015 at 17:07:29
thebordas
 Perhaps the Cary is not differentially balanced or uses some sort of transformer to achieve a balanced connection ?

 

RE: No, I prefer using RCA inputs and output on my Cary SLP 05 preamp, posted on February 12, 2015 at 17:39:32
thebordas
 I read the Stereophile review and measurements of the Cary and it was ripe with inconsistencies and discrepancies between the RCA and XLR pathways! No wonder you may find RCA sounding superior to balanced. They even use 2 buffer tubes for the balanced circuit wherein lies the most likely impediment to your balanced connections sounding somewhat diminished comparatively.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 13, 2015 at 03:38:47
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 I would contact Krell prior to exchanging any fuses.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 13, 2015 at 03:56:46
thebordas
 If I do it...I have used HiFi Tuning Supreme fuses in all my gear. Usually adds an extra level of purity and definition:)

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 13, 2015 at 09:46:38
thebordas
 I have a dealer who wants me to compare MIT HD38 Biwires to my TUltra's...no cost or obligation;)). How could I resist!!

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on February 13, 2015 at 15:32:01
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15518
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Nothing wrong w/ a friendly shoot-out. I look forward to your impressions.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on March 2, 2015 at 18:47:05
SgreenP@MSN.com
Audiophile

Posts: 3537
Joined: April 23, 2007
 Proper balanced circuits is actually 2 circuits, one for the + half and one for the - half of the circuit. As you probably can tell, balanced circuits like this are more expensive than single ended circuits. True balanced circuits are the hallmarks of companies like Ayre and Audio Research. XLR inputs on many components are there for pretense, and are really just single ended. Using balanced (XLR) cables for properly designed balanced circuits will give better performance...the reason for the increased costs of these components.

 

RE: XLR VS RCA, posted on March 6, 2015 at 15:22:54
PingPing
Audiophile

Posts: 196
Joined: May 22, 2014
 [quote]Bill Conrad stated that balanced circuitry in home audio gear is a solution looking for a problem[/quote]
imo, Bill Conrad is right, in this instance...


imo, there is no real benefit of using XLR ICs, unless you require 10m long ICs or your components do not have RCA sockets.

For me it depends on the RCA or XLR electronics and the quality of the RCA or XLR ICs not whether it is RCA or XLR, which is how I hear it.

With RCA ICs, if the noise is well controlled then RCAs can/should sound better than XLR ICs. In many instances though noise is not well controlled but noise is well controlled then RCA ICs can/should sound better :)

Unfortunately, XLR electronics remove 2nd order harmonics as part of the XLR noise filtering/cancelling process, which our ears like, but leaves the 3rd order harmonics in place including the noise, which our ears do not like... :)

Even more so, if the Hot and Cold XLR electronics is not well matched then the noise filtering/cancelling process can be even stronger where even more 2nd, and even 3rd, order harmonics are removed. I guess that will provide a smoother, maybe warmer, sound :)

 

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