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Just replaced regular fuse...

24.90.45.8
Posted on May 11, 2013 at 15:58:17
couger4u
Audiophile

Posts: 584
Location: New York
Joined: February 22, 2005
 With 4 HiFi Tuning fuse inside my Parasound A21. The best is the arrow towards the transformer. I have just started listening but there is definitely a small difference in top end with a little more sparkle. More listening required.

 

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RE: Just replaced regular fuse..., posted on May 11, 2013 at 19:19:22
John Elison
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Posts: 23900
Location: Central Kentucky
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Contributor
  Since: January 29, 2004
 I own a Parasound Halo A21 so I'll be interested in your final conclusion. Are these fuzes worth the money?

Speaking of money, how much do they cost? What value fuze do I need?

Thanks,
John Elison

 

RE: Just replaced regular fuse..., posted on May 11, 2013 at 19:42:46
couger4u
Audiophile

Posts: 584
Location: New York
Joined: February 22, 2005
 There are 4 fuses inside. All large 8A 250V slow blow. One outside also large 12A slow blow. I do not know the volt on it as I have not changed it but will at a later stage. Most probably it is also 250V. I bought the HiFi Tuning gold fuses as they are half off at Revolution Power website. I had asked Tony at Parasound about them. The only answer he could not give was the direction of the fuses. I put them in one way and the other and best sound I got was when the arrow was towards the transformer. Let me tell you John they are worth it. I hear better top end, bass has become a little more tubey and midrange is a little fuller. I spent about $106 including shipping for the 4 fuses. Try them if you can and let us know your findings.

 

RE: Just replaced regular fuse..., posted on May 11, 2013 at 22:11:40
John Elison
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  Since: January 29, 2004
 There are no 8A fuzes listed for the large gold slow-blow. You must have bought them out. ;-)

I would have to buy the large silver slow-blow fuzes for $60 each. That's too expensive for me.

Best regards,
John Elison

 

It is bizarre and unbelievable to some ..., posted on May 11, 2013 at 22:53:00
Rick58
Audiophile

Posts: 1118
Location: No. California
Joined: January 24, 2001
 but this does work, I have them in my McIntosh C220 preamp. The 'mains' fuse on the rear panel made an immediate difference, I then bought ones for the 3 (or 4? I forget) internal fuses (not really knowing what their function was). Made NO difference that I could ascertain.

Oh well, it was worth $120 or whatever (this was several years ago) to me to try the experiment. I left the internal ones in there anyway, the clips are VERY tight on those, I didn't want to risk cracking the main board changing them out again!

 

RE: Just replaced regular fuse..., posted on May 12, 2013 at 05:31:15
couger4u
Audiophile

Posts: 584
Location: New York
Joined: February 22, 2005
 I just checked Music Direct site also which sell these fuse at half off but no luck. People must have been buying them crazy because they are half off as they have few left whereas I saw a full listing for all amperage last week.. The rest of the sites are full price. Acoustic Sound also has them at full price and also VH Audio. Maybe the HiFi tuning is phasing out the gold fuse as they have supreme now or the sites just want to get rid of their stock. Too bad.

 

RE: Just replaced regular fuse..., posted on May 12, 2013 at 05:32:51
Kloss
 Is sound better due to fuse or due to replacing degraded fuse or by cleaning connection by the act of replacement?

 

A chain is only as strong as its weakest link., posted on May 12, 2013 at 06:06:58
Dave Pogue
Audiophile

Posts: 11689
Location: DC Area
Joined: October 9, 2001
 And when you think about it, this certainly applies to stock fuses, which are built to be weak, first and foremost. I figured a better-built fuse -- intended to do something other than blow -- was worth a try and bought a couple for my SET amps. The result was sufficiently impressive that I not only ended up with 8 of the things but figure they are really cheap for what they do.

 

RE: Just replaced regular fuse..., posted on May 12, 2013 at 06:19:29
couger4u
Audiophile

Posts: 584
Location: New York
Joined: February 22, 2005
 I believe it is the fuse. I have tried them on multiple components and on everyone I heard a difference in how they sounded for the better. Even with fuse I had not cleaned. I do not think it is degradation as the components were all almost new except for one.

 

Another option for you..., posted on May 14, 2013 at 06:08:58
kenster
Audiophile

Posts: 4523
Location: New Mexico
Joined: April 24, 2002

May I suggest you give the Synergistic Research SR20 fuses a try?

They have a very large selection including the 8A you need and they have a 30 day money back guarantee which no one else offers on fuses!

I have tried most of the available high end fuses and while all of them made a significant change, the SR20 fuses are a step above them all.

I have no affiliation with SR, just one very pleased customer...

~

 

Expectation bias me thinks..., posted on May 14, 2013 at 07:50:08
hifi heretic
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Posts: 898
Location: Suburban Philadelphia
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 after going to the trouble to purchase, then install the new premium fuse, it's reasonable to expect to hear a difference. ..And therein lies the problem. To eliminate the effect of expectation bias you would need a far more rigorous testing regimen that what you've described. ..So consider me considerably skeptical.

 

RE: Another option for you..., posted on May 14, 2013 at 11:30:20
John Elison
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Posts: 23900
Location: Central Kentucky
Joined: December 20, 2000
Contributor
  Since: January 29, 2004
 Thanks kenster, but Synergistic Research fuzes are too expensive for me at $70-each. I was a bit intrigued by the half-price offer on those other fuzes, but now that I think about it, I'm glad they were out of stock. I think it might have been a waste of money.

You know, if you really have all the disposable cash that you claim, and you want the best sound possible, simply replace all your fuzes with solid copper wire. As long as there is no malfunction in the amplifier, you should have the best sound possible for the price of a piece of wire. Of course, if something goes wrong down the road, it could cost quite a bit of your disposable cash.

Good luck,
John Elison

 

"me thinks" - that's highly unlikely. Doesn't listen, either., posted on May 14, 2013 at 11:33:28
carcass93
Audiophile

Posts: 7181
Location: NJ
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 "consider me considerably skeptical" - can't do, sorry. "Biased" and "inexperienced" would be much more appropriate considerations.

 

RE: "me thinks" - that's highly unlikely. Doesn't listen, either., posted on May 14, 2013 at 12:28:55
hifi heretic
Audiophile

Posts: 898
Location: Suburban Philadelphia
Joined: February 22, 2003
 inexperienced? ..In what way?

I suggest floating the idea that swapping one fuse w/ another makes a audible difference past an electrical engineer and see what his/her reply is.

 

RE: Another option for you..., posted on May 14, 2013 at 13:00:36
kenster
Audiophile

Posts: 4523
Location: New Mexico
Joined: April 24, 2002
 "simply replace all your fuzes with solid copper wire. As long as there is no malfunction in the amplifier, you should have the best sound possible for the price of a piece of wire"

Way ahead of you there Johnny! I explored that option many years ago and while it did make a substantial improvement, I chose safety over sound.

Best of luck to you too...

~

 

RE: Another option for you..., posted on May 14, 2013 at 14:57:03
John Elison
Audiophile

Posts: 23900
Location: Central Kentucky
Joined: December 20, 2000
Contributor
  Since: January 29, 2004
 Well, Kenny, it sounds to me like you don't have enough disposable cash after all. ;-)

 

RE: Another option for you..., posted on May 14, 2013 at 16:24:28
kenster
Audiophile

Posts: 4523
Location: New Mexico
Joined: April 24, 2002
 "Thanks kenster, but Synergistic Research fuzes are too expensive for me at $70-each. I was a bit intrigued by the half-price offer on those other fuzes, but now that I think about it, I'm glad they were out of stock. I think it might have been a waste of money."

What I find puzzling my dear boy is that SR offers a 30 day money back guarantee on their fuses and why one would not take advantage of that is quite frankly, puzzling. You are only out shipping and handling if you decide to return the fuses.

You may have some kind of bias against SR and that's your business but to not take advantage of an opportunity that would allow you to make an informed decision in your own system is both mentally miopic and a disservice to those that respect your experiences/knowledge.

To each his own though...

Have a great day!!!

 

RE: Another option for you..., posted on November 11, 2016 at 11:19:13
indranilsen69@gmail.com
Audiophile

Posts: 5
Joined: November 11, 2016
 Hello,
I am thinking of replacing the stock fuses of a Parasound Halo A21 amplifier and have a couple of questions for this audience who have a hands on experience with fuse replacement.
1. It seems to me that the main fuse which is in the signal path would be the most important fuse to replace and would yield the max improvement in sound. Replacement of the 4 internal fuses in the rails not being in the signal path might be optional. Would you agree?
2. My fuse options are Hifi tuning Supreme and Synergistic Quantum Black. I read rave reviews of Hifi tuning fuses used in Halo A21 but not so much on the new Synergistic Black fuse. Did anyone have an opportunity to compare these two fuses?
3. I tried cleaning the main stock fuse with DeOxit Gold contact cleaner and the result was a very harsh sound as if the fuse was not broken in. I have also found that the sound changes with the direction of the fuse. In one way it is relaxed with a very clear mid-range specially the voice with a little loose bass. The reverse direction produces a very fast, punchy sound with a controlled bass but it had a tad hazy mid-range specially the voice.. I wanted to get both but it is not possible at least with the current stock fuse. Did anybody experience this behavior with the direction of the fuse be it a stock or an expensive audiophile fuse?
Thanks

 

RE: Another option for you..., posted on November 11, 2016 at 23:08:59
Rick58
Audiophile

Posts: 1118
Location: No. California
Joined: January 24, 2001
 I would say from my experience with a McIntosh C220 preamp (see in this thread) that the mains fuse will make a difference, the internal ones may not. The main fuse isn't "in the signal path" but is in the juice coming into the component. The rail fuses are in the juice too but now after transformers and other electronic components. I didn't find that they made a noticeable difference.

I've only used the HiFi Tuning ones.

I remember thinking that one direction was 'better' than the other (mains fuse only in the C220). I used a familiar passage with things going on that I enjoy listening for (background fills etc., ambience, etc.). No, I didn't do any scientific tests but did swap the stock fuse in and out a couple times, and the orientation of the (maybe just the) HiFi fuse a couple times.

Of course I can't say there wasn't 'bias' or whatever but $60 is not a lot of money compared to the cost of the component so it was a fun experiment. I believe there was a small but noticeable improvement in the sound and one direction sounded a wee bit better than the other (and both better than the stock fuse).

 

RE: Just replaced regular fuse..., posted on November 12, 2016 at 04:57:54
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15524
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 The fuse movement is really taking off, making our gear sound better.

 

RE: Another option for you..., posted on November 12, 2016 at 09:26:14
Palustris
Audiophile

Posts: 2408
Location: Cape Cod
Joined: September 12, 2008
 I would be interested in learning how the main fuse on the primary of the power transformer is in the signal path but the rail voltage fuses are not in the signal path. I suppose that we all understand that the primary fuse simply energizes the power transformer and the audio signal modulates the rail voltages. It seems that you have got it backwards!

 

RE: Just replaced regular fuse..., posted on November 12, 2016 at 09:30:41
bare
Audiophile

Posts: 1879
Joined: April 14, 2009
 PT Barnum would be proud.
Certainly Not news in audio land

 

RE: Another option for you..., posted on November 12, 2016 at 11:35:54
indranilsen69@gmail.com
Audiophile

Posts: 5
Joined: November 11, 2016
 Hi Palustris(A),
You are very correct and the main fuse is not the signal path. This in fact reminds me of a discussion that I had with Parasound technical team regarding the fuse layout and tthey confirmed that none the fuses used in the Halo A21 amp are on the signal path I.e they don't use any speaker fuse in this amplifier design.
However what I wanted to find out was if replacing the main fuse is going to give you the biggest bang for the buck since it is at the main entry point of the amplifier. I thought that should be the case but just wanted to get some feedback from
this group. Hope that clarifies..

 

RE: Another option for you..., posted on November 12, 2016 at 14:12:23
Palustris
Audiophile

Posts: 2408
Location: Cape Cod
Joined: September 12, 2008
 Well when I said, "the audio signal modulates the rail voltages," I was making the argument that the rail voltage IS in the signal path. It might be more accurate to say that the rail voltages are part of the current loop that modulates the audio signal. If you think of the loop as current from the rails to ground through active devices that modulate the signal, then you can see that the fuses, since they are in series with this current flow, are in the signal path.

 

RE: Just replaced regular fuse..., posted on November 28, 2016 at 10:17:33
indranilsen69@gmail.com
Audiophile

Posts: 5
Joined: November 11, 2016
 Hello Couger4U(A),
I have recently replaced both the main and the 4 rail stock fuses of my Parasound A21 amplifier with Hifi tuning fuses. I replaced these fuses in sequence. First replaced only the main fuse by Hifi Tuning Silverstar fuse and it immediately improved, while breaking in, the sound in all areas.
Then I replaced the 4 rail fuses with Hifi Tuning Gold fuses (couldn't get the Silverstar in 8A) with arrow pointing to the flow of the current i.e pointing from the transformer to the capacitor. The result wasn't so impressive. While it increased the clarity but the instruments started sounding very hazy and smeared. The overall sound was also veiled. It has been 20 odd hours since I replaced the internal fuses and they might still be going through the break-in interval. I tried flipping the fuses such that they point to the transformer to see if that resolves the haziness but it didn't.
Did you have similar experience when you replaced the rail fuses by Hifi Tuning gold fuses inside the Halo A21? Did you have to go through any break-in period with those fuses or did it sound great right from the get go? Any feedback/help in this regard would be really appreciated.
Thanks.

 

RE: Just replaced regular fuse..., posted on December 6, 2016 at 09:59:33
Mendel
Audiophile

Posts: 1207
Location: GTA
Joined: January 17, 2009
 I replaced the main fuse in my Audio Research SP 14 preamp and the tube fuses in my Rogue Audio Stereo 90 with (half price) HiFi gold fuses. The improvement was easily noticeable and very worthwhile. Have not tried the newer more expensive fuses available, but I may do so down the road.
Not sure why these things work, but the proof is in the hearing.
The only ones doubting these fuses are those who haven't tried them.

 

Production costs primarily..., posted on December 7, 2016 at 08:41:36
Jay Buridan
Audiophile

Posts: 10284
Location: Michigan
Joined: January 21, 2004



In the beautiful box!

"Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. "
― W.C. Fields

 

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