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... I've been using the original issue mat on my Thorens TD125 - mostly out of lazyness and the fact that changing mats did not sound like an exciting or very significant tweak.I don't remember what I read about the Herbie's Way Excellent mat, but I decided that it was worth a shot - especially since they have a 30-day return policy and they take PayPal (I prefer using PayPal to using credit cards online - especially with smaller and lesser known merchants - kudos to Herbie's Audio Lab for taking PayPal.)
The mat arrived just 3 days after I put the order in (one more kudos for fast shipping.)
Finally, after a hard day at work, I had a chance to put the mat on and do some serious listening. I took just a few seconds to realize that the mat improved the sound considerably in terms of blacker background, tighter and more pronounced bass, and more detail on higher octaves. I'll wait a couple of more days and do some A/B with the older mat and post a more detailed update, but so far I think this might be one my best tweaks yet.
Alberto
PS I included the pic of the TD125 that's getting the new mat ... just because I like to look at other people TTs and set-ups and I assume others do too.
Follow Ups:
you didn't answer the first querier.
WarmestTimbo in Oz
The Skyptical Mensurer and Audio Scrounger'Still not saluting.'
Read about and view system at:
http://www.theanalogdept.com/tim_bailey.htm
If the two mat's weights are appreciably different this can shift the suspension's smooth bounce to a wobble.Which ought to be audible, and IMO&E, is.
BTA my matt is quite heavy, an ancient mineral loaded SE22 from Nagaoka.
The TD125 still has only three? springs IIRC.
I always set up suspensions with the mat and an LP added for the final bounce adjustment stage. In my case I have to include the clamp by GB - of decca-mount fame?
IME&O Thorens sprungies, and hungies, can benefit from a clamp that grips the spindle and tightens the LP down over a washer onto a good absorptive - but stiffish mat, like my SE22. (even Linns, Timbo? yes, but shush, not so loud!).I'm not overkeen on soft gooey / sticky mats on sprungies (where the mass sits above the springs). The peeling-off of the LP from the mat can root the suspension set-up very quickly.
Unlike some here who think suspension set-up is a snap, (I do it - carefully and I listen - for money) and I don't For > 2 decades and it's still not something I like repeating at home. And so I mention this to customers. And that I'll be coming back more often.
Doesn't seem to bother hungies like SME's 20 and 30, Oracles with a very sticky mat, or Michell's. Probably because there's less compliance at the top and bottom of the springs/towers, where sprungies tend to use rubber grommets which will move about and take the spring with them, bending it off plumb verttical!
NB I tried both the old Dumpa /Spectra mats and that blue-green thing from the USA, way back when, see. ;-)!
But, Linn's and Thorens's may not have enough spindle height, needing a fitter or tool-maker to make you an extension.
worth doing.
WarmestTimbo in Oz
The Skyptical Mensurer and Audio Scrounger'Still not saluting.'
Read about and view system at:
http://www.theanalogdept.com/tim_bailey.htm
The bottom part of the mat sticks to the platter but the top part doesn't stick to the record. Quite an ingenious design.Bobby
Love the Thorens. Love the booth it's in too - I have my system in a little alcove - what's the story behind yours ? It looks treated. Any difference ?
it's the apotheosis of der Thorens.I have been thinking that my spot mat is the best thing but I am going to really have to try Herbie's mat.
Hey, I use the same Ikea lamp for my table.
~Slainte,
The OMalley
I like my Herbie's mat on my Russco idler very much, but I was prepared to not like it before trying it (sorbothane mats are so often recommended for idlers). It is also wonderful on a suspended TT (sounds great with my Thorens TD150 MkII, where I borrowed it from at first). I may play around with other mats in the future, but who knows.Steve's other products that I've tried are also terrific. When I was experimenting with different schemes of draining-isolating vibration in my Russco he took some items back for a refund after I decided I didn't want to use them (I ended up exchanging them for some tube dampers etc instead :)), no questions asked.
Jim
i am a bit skeptical.. anyone using it?
> i am a bit skeptical.. anyone using it?I was very skeptical too. In fact, when the box arrived I opened it very carefully thinking that there was a greater than 50% chance I'd be sending it back (60 bucks is 60 bucks after all).
My take is that since one of the "known issues" with DD TTs (like your Technics) is vibration from direct coupling with the motor, a mat like this might help.
Since they offer a money back guarantee and take PayPal you can try it first hand if nobody answers.
If you try it, please let us know how it worked for you.
Now that I have experienced first-hand the difference a mat can make I am curious to try some of the other much acclaimed mats (like the RingMat). With 3 active turntables in use, I have a semi-good justification for more mats :-).
Alberto
not gona try it till i get some feedback from other technics owners.
i am not rich enough to be the guinea pig. :)
.
~Slainte,
The OMalley
Hi Joel,Thank you for reposting a pic of your beautiful TD125 - love the graphite accents.
The table is indeed one of Doug's masterpieces. I get a lot of compliments on it. My TD124s sound a tad better than the TD125, but they don't look 1/2 as good (and they are pretty good looking IMO - see pic) so the 125 gets the center spot.
Hey, since we are talking. What do you use to polish the rim of the platter and keep it nice and shiny?
Alberto
Hello Alberto - I have not yet polished the platter yet and it has indeed over time become a little duller. I was thinking about chrome plating it - but when I called a chrome plating outfit today they told me that with a cast aluminium platter it would not be advisable. So it's on to the regular alu polish Doug recommended to use paper towels or an old cotton shirt or something similar. Do polish it before the rim gets too oxidized. Use some rubbing alcohol to help remove the black residu from the polish and it should clean up nicely. You can even try some clear finger nail polish after you are done.
Cheers,
Jw
After polishing, you might consider spraying it with a clear lacquer to maintain the sparkle (available in an aerosol can).
That's a good idea. The nail polish thing may be difficult to apply evenly. I am a little wary of doing something that cannot be easily undone if you know what I mean. Suppose it does not look good, or I apply it incorrectly. It may turn out to be messy. Would you recommend a special brand/type of clear lacquer?Thanks for the suggestion.
Jw
Once you apply a lacquer, it's more difficult to remove and do a polish, but, applied correctly, you shouldn't have to.I'd just go for Rust-Oleum (see link), but try it first on the bottom of
your platter to be sure you're happy with the result. And remember, no matter what, it's all reversible (high numerical-grit wet 'n dry sandpaper)Another alternative would be a paste wax on the newly-polished surface. Anything to slow the oxidation process. Less permanent than the lacquer, so requiring more upkeep.
If you apply a wax, be sure to use a mat betwixt lp and platter. Just to be on the safe side, eh?.........:-)
Your 125 does indeed look gorgeous.Just about to replace the stock mat on my 124 with whatever the good people at Herbie's recommended for it.
Any leads on who may have designed that base - i see that inmate Joel Waterman seems to have commented about it being an 'Olsen" creation? Whomever made it certainly has the visual aspect of base construction down. Makes my base look a bit like an arts & crafts project -- and the dark stain looks very refined.. well done.
I assume the table sounds lovely -- what cart do you have on that 3009?
Great job on that table -- you're right, we love to look and drool over ea. others tables -- i love looking at special amps and the like, but turntables are so personal, and in the end, much more aesthetic that other gear.
Yes, it's a Doug Olsen table.> I assume the table sounds lovely -- what cart do you have on that 3009?
On the pic I have an M97XE, but I am currently using a Clearaudio Aurum Beta Wood which, not surprisingly given the $400 price tag, sounds much better than the Shure - which is no slouch.
> Great job on that table -- you're right, we love to look and drool
> over ea. others tables -- i love looking at special amps and the
> like, but turntables are so personal, and in the end, much more > aesthetic that other gear.I agree, turntables are a great platform for experimenting with designs and "expressing" yourself. You can change so many things: materials, dimensions, suspension, armboard, choice and number of tonearms, etc... a tweaker's delight.
nt
BTW, beautiful table, I have a 125 that I am restoring, I will be happy if mine eventually looks 1/2 as niceMike
Hi Mike, I got the thicker version (the deluxe), it was $58.50.Good luck with your restoration. The plinth is made from Doug Olsen ("about2" on this forums and eBay) he's a great guy and I have yet to see prettier TD125 plinths anywhere.
Alberto
...very classy indeed, looks like you have some sound deadening type stuff around it too? Good idea.
nt
mainly because the stock felt mat kept clinging to my records when I would lift them off the table, and I'll be damned if it doesn't make the P9 sound a bit better too! I have never been much of a tweaker, but hearing is believing.
...so that's where it's gone; you got it... congratulations. Welcome to the Olsen-club - we are a descerning and fortunate lot :-) And I concur about the mat - I went from stock to Ringmat to Herbie.Jw
*
Herbies Way Excellent Mat was a big improvement over the original mat on my Garrard 401. Steve Herbelin of Herbies is a super guy to deal with.
Alberto,Nice looking turntable, I use one of the Herbie's Audio Lab mats on my VPI Scoutmaster and think it has really firmed up the sound quite a bit. I guess that I am going to have to give one a shot on my Thorens TD165.
Jeff
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