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This has been a topic of conversation here before, so I thought I would share a recent posting from a board for orchestral musicians who are members of the ICSOM orchestras (International Congress of Symphony and Opera Orchestra Members - basically the major full-time professional orchestras in the US and abroad).
The topic was How Long Can A Person Endure Certain Noise Levels Before Hearing Impairment Occurs?
These are the accepted standards for recommended permissible exposure duration for continuous time weighted average noise, according to NIOSH and CDC. For every 3dB SPL over 85dB, the permissible exposure time is cut in half, before hearing loss can occur. Bear in mind this is continuous average exposure, and may not represent a worldwide view of the subject.
82dB - 16 hours
85dB - 8 hours
88 dB - 4 hours
91dB - 2 hours
94dB - 1 hour
97dB - 30 minutes
100dB - 15 minutes
103dB - 7.5 minutes
106dB - less than 4 minutes
109dB - less than 2 minutes
112dB - less than 1 minute
115dB - under 30 seconds
This is a very big topic of discussion among orchestral musicians worldwide at the moment. It has been proven that the average orchestral musician will lose at least 20% of their hearing over the course of their career. I thought audiophiles would find this interesting, especially those of you who listen very loudly for long periods of time.
Follow Ups:
All those years in 8x8 practice rooms with a 9 1/2" Brass Bell next to my left ear. All those years with 2 other Trombones to my left and a Tuba on the right and most of the time, sitting in front of the Percussion section.My Tinnitis is in the same key as Janacek's "Sinfonietta".
LIBERTY ONCE LOST,
IS LOST FOREVER
-JOHN ADAMS
Edits: 08/11/12
the Atlanta Symphony Orchestra as has ear plugs back stage for the musicians. Of course it is up the individual to decide whether to use them during the performance or not.
All of the ICSOM orchestras, as far as I am aware, and many other smaller organizations, supply the cheap foam earplugs backstage, yes. Also, all ICSOM orchestras would have a set of sound shields, as well. Many people, including myself, strongly dislike the sound shields, though, as they have a big effect on what you are hearing from across the stage, and they are also often in the way, depending on what you are doing. Wearing earplugs also of course even more drastically changes what things sound like. Many musicians do not use them for symphonic subscription concerts for this reason, using them only for pops shows and outdoor concerts. They do have more expensive custom ones made of different materials and fitted to your ear that are supposedly much better, but I personally have not experimented with them yet.
...the musicians around you?
LIBERTY ONCE LOST,
IS LOST FOREVER
-JOHN ADAMS
/
I'm a pro violinist, and just figure I've given my hearing for art....
Its called age related hearing loss.
Sit in front of the trumpets for a while and your top end is sliced off etc. I have met a number of orchestral musicians that aknowledge their hearing loss as a price for what they do but, at the seattle symphony, they still have put up sound shields in front of the trumpets in the past due to complaints.
I hated those sound shields. As a trumpet player I was always hearing the sound bounce back from various points in the hall during rehearsals, it gives you an idea as to how loud to play during fortissimo passages. When the hall was filled with people during concerts, you would have an idea as to how hard to really play, the filled hall would be a lot less "live" but the sound would still carry over the top of a full orchestra playing fortissimo. With the sound shields in place, I had to play that much louder to hear any sound "bounce back", which sort of defeated the purpose of those sound shields, unfortunately.
I have had my share of dirty looks from string players, sorry...
TR
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What does "20% of their hearing over the course of their career" mean. How is that measured? It is well documented that hearing ability diminishes as we age. How do you put a % on it and how do you distinguish between normal loss and that caused by the orchestra?
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I guess I thought it would be obvious that the 20% hearing loss would be in addition to normal age-related loss, most of which would not take place until after many musician's careers would be over. And of course, age-related loss varies quite a bit from individual to individual.
if all you do is collect vinyl and turntables and never LISTEN TO MUSIC, it has nothing to do with vinyl.
If the message was about soundstage would you have posted your query?
Our ears are rather important "investments" and need taken are of.
******************************
Music. Window or mirror?
can be subjected to quite loud levels. when i attended disney hall in the cheap seat BEHIND the orch (it still was fantastic sound), i saw that the seats of players in front of horn players had sonic shields behind their heads. EXcellent idea.
...regards...tr
I sat in a few orchestras for several years, trumpet section. Most professional orchestras rotate the string players to avoid hearing damage, or use sound barriers. Unfortunately, the last few orchestras I played in I was next to the trombones on my left and have suffered 30% hearing loss in my left ear. But I have no regrets, it was the best years of my life.
TR
That began with a rebellion by the Chicago Symphony players in front of the Brass, although why Violists would need to hear I have no idea.
What's the definition of a minor second?
Two violists playing in unison.
What's the definiton of "perfect pitch?"
Throwing a viola into a dumpster without hitting the rim.
Why do violists stand for long periods outside people's houses?
They can't find the key and they don't know when to come in.
LIBERTY ONCE LOST,
IS LOST FOREVER
-JOHN ADAMS
MUSICIANS.
...regards...tr
"Well, decide. You can't do both."
Dan
Largest orchestral climaxes hit about 93 dB on my RS Meter.
Dave
Are you measuring from the audience when getting that reading? On stage, it can easily hit 101dB or even higher in the loudest climaxes, depending on the size of the ensemble, etc.
Sorry I wasn't being clear - that was listening to classical music on my system at home. Measured from my usual listening position.
Dave
screaming...I lost 937% of my hearing by not have some wolves raise him instead of my wife and I.
I thought about simply feeding him non-stop, but he didn't like food, either.
Then he hit teen years, ate me out of house and home...but never stopped screaming!
******************************
Music. Window or mirror?
Loudest when i listen to opera.. the usual climax singing will hit mid 70's dB.
My usual listening is in the mid 60's C weighted
Do you live in a rural area? Many of us that live in the city are forced to consider 40-60dB noise as background oftentimes. I listen in the mid 70's because of the background. I am jealous, that would make your orchestral recordings sound very much more real to be played at a proper level.
because kids are pumping distorted noise into their ears day in and day out via shitty earbuds on ipods.
I was stunned how bad those standards earbuds that come with ipods are.
I have no idea t all about how loud the music I listen to is. It usually isn't loud. Most acoustic stuff sounds best to me at relatively low levels. It's good information to know, though.
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