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It seems that add-on supertweeters seem to be a much less talked about topic these days outside of multi way horn setups, perhaps because current tweeters have much higher extension than their predecessors?
I have a pair of Wilson Sophia 2 that I like quite a bit but feel that if I can get more air and soundstage without breaking the bank, it would be a welcomed idea. I'm looking at a Taket Batpro2 from Japan (found an english site of it. See below). From a spec perspective, the Wilson's are not short on treble extension, so I wonder if this inexpensive supertweeter or any supertweeter is going to do me any good。
Any thoughts?
Thanks.
Follow Ups:
If the design incorporates a 1" or 3/4" dome tweeter, the thing should get out to at least 18K, which is more than enough for MOST of us at "our" age.
ScanSpeak and other good quality tweeters keep going past 20K too... there should be no reason at all to need a supertweeter.
Now, if you talk about "full-range" drivers and "horn" drivers...
Full-range speakers, especially larger diameter ones, very often roll off too soon for some tastes. So, a supertweeter is added in - usually 5K to 8K, which is very high and too high for the kind of spacing that is usually involved. Same thing with horns - a typical horn has a rolloff rate that is dependent on various physical elements of the compression driver, throat and horn. Very often in PA and home environments these horns have either "constant directivity compensation/equalization" or a supertweeter is added. Again, the physical spacing is generally not recommended at the typical frequencies used for crossover points.
That said, some full range and horn guys think nothing of adding their supertweeters into the mix and do not worry at all about these comb filtering and lobing effects.
Myself, I have no reason for supertweeters for the types of speakers I typically run, which almost always have 1" soft dome or aluminum dome tweeter.
I am really partial to a good quality soft dome...
Subs? That's another matter - and they're not as prohibitive and difficult to add into a system as people think, and very much easier and more practical to add than a supertweeter, from a technical standpoint.
Cheers,
Presto
Adding a super-tweeter will extend frequency response in some cases. But, unless it is designed to integrate perfectly with the rest of the loudspeaker...
I would do it if I still had a dog in the house.
As for me, both of my ears max out at 14K so it would be worthless
My earlier model Reference 3As came standard with Murata supertweeters. At 76 with tinnitus and measured steep down curve at 8800kz, I can still appreciate the addition to the overall sound those tweeters make. Obviously I cant hear them directly - only their effect on the general sound quality which is great.
A super tweeter needs to be designed with loudspeaker in mind just adding one to existing loudspeakers could cause issues.
Thank you, all, for your responses.
It appears that most of you are pretty much against the idea.
I agree totally that we are not born as bats and the last time I checked, I could barely hear 16kHz at my age (40s). I also agree that a supertweeter probably affects more of what's under 20kHz than above in terms of audibility. What I was hopefully looking for is perhaps some first hand experience with supertweeters and what they do (good or bad) to the sound of a system, and from the responses, it seems that the idea is indeed out of fashion and not many had tried or want to try such implementation, perhaps because of the lack of credibility and scientific grounds of such tweaks.
Thanks.
I'm sure most of use have gone down that path at some point in our audio experiments. I know I have!
Just trying to save you a few bucks and a lot of wasted time.
If you want to improve your top end then look into capacitor upgrades, speakers with ribbon tweeters, etc.....
Hey! buy what ever you want :-) Buy Six pairs for all it matters to me. Most ODD that you seek Forum approval though.
Personally I think/believe those are just another way to extract $$ from the gullible.
Do you think even for a moment, that IF Wilson thought there was benefit They wouldn't be factory fitted to Your Speakers ??
What a super tweeter is supposed to do is improve the waveform in the regions we can hear, The argument is analagous to why an amp shouldn't cut off at 20 KHz.
But remember you really can't just throw a super tweeter on top of a system. It needs a proper crossover with a good transfer function just like any other crossover point in a well designed speaker. Otherwise it's for affect not reproduction.
Exactly. Adding a supertweter onto an existing speaker will destroy the top end response, which will be audible. Maintaining a small distance between drivers is critical at high frequencies, and the overlap in coverage between the existing tweeter and the add-on will introduce significant cancellation effects starting as low as 4kHz.
I may not know to what I write, but it seems to me that the midrange is more degraded than are the highs. We old guys are apt to not recognize speech more than not being able to hear the metalic sheen of a triangle. Hearing aids have the mids boosted surprisingly and don't tackle the highs at all. When I read the offer for these tweeters, there is no money back guarantee, so I would not go for the deal...however, if you can arrange an audition, it may very well be advantageous.
How old are you?
Where do you live ambient sound wise? City, country, near a train station?
If you are over 50 I would bet hard cash your hearing rolls off at around 7-10kHz anyway.
I was looking for something in the 200kHz range.
I saw that...
-Karma
I have never bought into the idea of add on supertweeters as I do not accept that they add to the listening experience by extending the frequency response beyond the upper limits of the majority of people's hearing ability.What they certainly do do, however, is add a spurious treble response extending down into the normal audible bandwidth. It is not how high they extend but how low they go. There is no low brick wall cut off at, say, 20kHz. Rather they typically gradually roll off to say - 20dB @10kHz or below. There are published measurements to support this (Keith Howard, for example, has written on this with his measurements in various audio journals).
One of my direct experiences was with a friend who had bought a pair of ribbon supertweeters and had them connected to his Mark Levinson pre/power/ Sonus Faber system. He was playing the radio and switched the super tweeters in and out. He pointed out the clear difference and attributed this to the ability of the supertweeter to reveal previously unheard high frequency information above the louspeaker's upper response of circa. 20kHz. However he was not knowledgable enough to know that the FM radio signal we listened to had no program information above 15kHz. Incidenattly I recall that Keith Howard's measurments of the same device showed audible output down to 7kHz.
You may also find it instructive to listen to any given supertweeter with no loudspeaker attached. I am happy to predict that you will hear the supertweeter chirping away at considerably lower than "ultrasonic" frequencies
Edits: 11/15/15 11/15/15
I think you're dead on. I wouldn't be without Tannoy ST-100 on top of the Esotar tweeters in Merlin VSM, doubtless because the output of the STs extends well down into the audible range below their nominal 18K crossover point. My tested hearing is limited to 14 kHz.
I'm less concerned about add-on tweeters because I can't hear past 10 or 11-kHz anymore. When I was young I could hear all the way up to 18 and 20-kHz. I seem to enjoy music just as much if not more, but I'm into bass, now. Consequently, I use add-on subwoofers instead of add-on super tweeters. ;-)
Best regards,
John Elison
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