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Can anyone recommend a good version of TROS? I had an LP from MHS years back that I really liked, but I no longer have it (CD only, now). I would love to find that performance on CD, but dont know who did it. Any body have any favorites on CD?
Follow Ups:
I'm reminded of a story from my student days. My wife (then fiance) and I were perusing music at the Detroit Public Library when I came across a POCKET SCORE of the Rite. The pages couldn't have been taller than 6". This was not a reduction, but the full orchestral score. I opened to one of the more dense passages and found about 25 black streaks across the page, none of it was actually legible. I checked it out and shared a good laugh with some of my friends. This tiny little book was all but useless. They may as well have put the score on the head of a pin.
The sheer density of the score has deep implications for the myriad recordings that are out there. I don't think I've ever heard a recording of the Rite (I own 6 or 7 versions myself and have heard many others) that didn't give me some kind of fresh insight into the score. With virtually every new recording I hear, I notice some part or another that I didn't previously realize was there. I really can't say that about any other piece that comes to mind. Of course, the sheer number of recordings of the Rite has something to do with this. I'm sure lots of other modern works would yield the same kind of result if there were more recordings available for comparison. Pieces from earlier eras just don't have those kind of depths to be plumbed, no matter how great they may be. Sure tempos and overall approach may change, but you don't have notes jumping out at you that you just didn't hear before. So, I seem to manage to find something of value in just about every performance I've heard. The weakest ones I know are usually the oldest ones. I'm not sure if there are any pre-war recordings of the ROS that can be considered definitive. Some of the oldest I've heard are downright rickety. It was decades before the state of playing technique was truly up to the demands presented by the score.
As I mention downthread, the Dutoit/Montreal is quite good. After listening to the Boulez/Cleveland on YT yesterday, I think I need at least one more recording of this piece in my library. That one has many of the same virtues of the Dutoit, but with a bit more bite and, again, a few new (to me) surprises. Even in nasty lo-fi digital all of that came across quite clearly.
Enjoy your quest!
dh
Yes - almost every recording will yield some new detail or interesting balance. I was also trying to suggest this in my initial response to this thread. The point where I draw the line however is where the new, interesting details are "uncovered" by dweebs in the control room moving volume controls for the zillions of spot microphones, thereby disrupting the holistic image the orchestra. If that's the way I hear get to hear new details, I don't want it. I know other listeners here don't feel as strongly about this as I (and others, such as Timbo) do.
I would agree with you on this point as well. I don't think that's usually what's going on, but of course there will likely be exceptions.
dh
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If there's one recording where you can hear some awful multiple-microphoning, with forests of spot microphones all over kingdom come, it's the Salonen/LAPO DG album, which includes the Rite of Spring (also Bartok's Miraculous Mandarin and Moussorgsky's Night on Bald Mountain). I still have the SACD though, since the sound (e.g., the floor-shaking entrance of the organ in the Miraculous Mandarin) is fun - in a kind of horrific way! ;-)
I learned a great deal about many performance details watching Bernstein rehearsing a talented youth orchestra.
Whatever you settle on, you have to hear the last pages of the Rite under Ozawa. They are just incredible. The Chicago SO swing like the Basie band - and I'm sure a lot of them are no strangers to jazz scores.
There's a knack to making a big band swing - the bass needs to be slightly ahead of the rest so it gives the impression of "pushing" the ensemble. And the brass, of course has to be very sharp and on the beat. You get all this and more..... marvellous!
Listen from 31.00 on. This is real S-Y-N-C-O-P-A-T-I-O-N
OK, Andy, try this version, which I like as much as Ozawa's:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTLj07tFKz4&index=14&list=PLUSRfoOcUe4bhdE-XfQZk6cGuATzEGorf
I thought the Ozawa was with the CSO, but it's the BSO. And they play just as well for Zander. Incredible precision. They just have this score well and truly mastered. Zander takes it a fraction quicker.
But.........it doesn't swing like Ozawa. That's uniquely what he does - he just "gets" the syncopation and makes it happen. I know of no other version that does this.
I'll listen again for the Ozawa "swing." I had that performance on a "Dynaflex"floppy LP that didn't do it justice.
By the way, Zander is conducting the Boston Philharmonic, not the BSO:
"The Boston Philharmonic is a 501(c)3 nonprofit organization dedicated to fulfilling a vision of "passionate music making without boundaries." The Boston Philharmonic Orchestra (BPO), founded by Benjamin Zander in 1979, features student, professional, and amateur musicians who present premier performances of top-notch classical music that is accessible and enjoyable for both music aficionados and the casual listener."
Ah - the BPO. Incredible. What an orchestra!
Ozawa was the Chicago SO as I thought - somebody else referred to it as the BSO.
This is the first version of Rite I heard (on LP).
Edits: 09/03/16
Rite of Spring - Chicago
Petrouchka - Boston
nt
Nice pics! and excellent info guys.
The transparency is incredible, and not a bad recording for Columbia. Precise rhythms can generate as much excitement as speed.
"The transparency is incredible, and not a bad recording for Columbia." I like this performance a lot. Much of the transparency is attributable to Boulez and CLE, of course, but I think there was some help from multi-miking. For example, underneath the fanfares near the end of Part I, you can hear a repeated climbing figure played by the solo bass clarinet (Alfred Zetzer, who was briefly my clarinet teacher). There is no way that this sounds as clear in concert (and I heard Boulez conduct it in Severance Hall in the late 70s). His DG remake isn't as energetic.
Other performances I like include Salonen/LA and van Zweden.
nt
For one thing, the Cleveland Orchestra plays vastly better than the freelance pickup "Columbia Symphony" ensemble Stravinsky himself had to use. And the trademark Boulez clarity and precision pay big dividends.
Boulez recorded the Rite earlier as well, a release that came out on Nonesuch in the US. Was it that one that set Stravinsky off? Stravinsky famously didn't like Karajan's recording, either, but said "Wow" to the first Bernstein.
Not enough bite.
I agree. I have two versions on CD, one of which is the Bernstein version. I just cant quite seem to warm up to it, although I do like Bernsteins work in general.
My copy is an old mono 6-eye. Performance was OK overall, but the woodwinds are very recessed--some really important stuff is virtually inaudible. I also played the Dutoit/Montreal LP on London, which is the recording I "imprinted on". That one seems to have quite a few advocates. It's well-recorded and the complex detailed score comes across quite well. Jarvi made a nice one with Detroit about 20 years ago which has very well-recorded percussion--really adds to the visceral impact of the piece.
dh
First, Sixten Ehrling on BIS with the Swedish Radio Symphony Orchestra (1988) with a good Symphony of Psalms. I heard Ehrling perform the Rite on at least two occasions while he was leading the Detroit Symphony in the late '60s. It was one of his specialties.
The second is the first Rite that I owned as a young lad. It was a Christmas gift that caused some concern back in the early '60s. Ansermet and the L'Orchestre de la Suisse Romande on London. Although the performance was great, the cover was even more memorable. Later LP releases were more modest, covering up the exposed breast.
until at least 2000, once remarked to me that Ehrling was his favorite among all DSO conductors with whom had worked.
Because memories tend to fade overtime.
You're welcome!
The LP has become more expensive since I bought it a few years back but it does have beautiful documentation. This is a fine re-issue. I haven't heard the corresponding CD.
"If people don't want to come, nothing will stop them" - Sol Hurok
Alain Lombard conducting
You'll probably get a lot of recommendations. (And they'll probably all be good!) Some recordings (possibly under-the-radar in some cases) that are on my mind right now are:
(I heard this one for the first time a few months ago, and it was a big, shocking surprise in its inexorable power. The microphones are distant, in the Collins Classics manner, but they pick up a lot of natural detail. It may be hard to find these days? I found a used copy. I haven't heard de Burgos' much earlier set, with the Philharmonia Orchestra, on EMI.)
. . . and. . . yes. . . (although I no longer have this recording)
I have not returned to verify this for a long while, but my sense has been that Stravinsky was often not the best conductor of his own works.
But Markevitch was splendid, particularly on the Rite. And, IMO (not humble) better than Boulez!
Jeremy
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