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In Reply to: RE: Tinnitus and digital sound... posted by tketcham on January 09, 2015 at 11:50:01
What exactly is the issue with the original DAC and sample rates? It looks like it has a usb input, and i don't think i would need a remote for it. The old version looks like it has 5 filter choices and the new one appears to have only 3.
Follow Ups:
I'm not aware of any issues with the sampling rates available with the original DAC other than a deal breaker for some people is that the USB input is limited to 16bit/48K. The simple solution is to use a USB-to-SPDIF converter from your computer/server to the co-axial input on the DAC.As to the DAC-R having fewer filter options, the one filter I noticed that they no longer offer is the minimum phase soft-knee filter for lower sampling rates. I find that it's a good one for well-recorded and properly mastered CDs, otherwise I use the minimum phase apodising filter for just about everything. Being able to switch between filters remotely would be a nice feature but I find that listening to music for an extended period and then re-listening with a different filter is just as productive, it just takes longer. For me the two best filters stood out fairly quickly when I played some of the more strident CDs I have.
The more I listen to a range of CDs through the Rega DAC the more I'm convinced that I've made headway into taming the sometimes harsh sound of Redbook CD. I'm quite content listening to CDs for hours and don't shy away from some of my collection like I did before the Rega DAC.
No guarantee that you'll find the same, so it's a bit of a gamble. But you won't know unless you try. That's why I went with a used DAC at a price I could justify; if it didn't work out I could always sell it and not lose much.
Regards,
Tom
Edits: 01/31/15
I think I might go that route, the converters look pretty simple. I've seen a handful of the original DAC for sale in the $500-600 range. I would use it with my Rotel as a transport. I also have three nice quality Onkyo Dvd players piling up as the formats kept changing before blu-ray came out. Would those work well as a transport? One is a SACD player also and reads a couple discs that my Rotel won't.
I've used an Oppo BDP-103 to play CDs through the Rega DAC so I don't see why any of your disc players wouldn't also work with SACD as long as the players have digital output.I did read (and have experienced) where occasionally the DAC is unable to lock onto a signal but it's usually the fault of the player, not the DAC. In my case the Apollo CDP that I use wasn't able to correctly read a commercial CD and was sending garbage to the DAC. All I had to do was rip and burn a copy of the CD and the CD-R plays "perfectly". (See edit comment below.)
And that's why I happened to use the Oppo to play CDs; I was troubleshooting the Apollo problem. The funny thing is, the Oppo was able to read the CD just fine. What's really weird is that the Apollo could correctly read and play that CD through the internal DAC and analog outputs but couldn't send a proper digital signal to the external DAC. That's just one of the reasons why I'll always prefer vinyl; fewer things to drive you crazy. :-)
Edited : Regarding the odd behavior of the Apollo and the bad digital signal; I got a reply from Conor Poull, Service Manager at the The Sound Organisation, Rega's USA distributor and he said "... we have run into this issue before. It's actually an issue with the protection code on the disc itself. Because the copy protection is causing the digital out issue, you won't see it in analog, or with a ripped copy of the disc." So there you have it, mystery solved.
Tom
Edits: 01/12/15 01/12/15
One dac available on A-gon stated as new in box. Another for a bit less on ebay but for some reason the seller is blocking out the serial number in the picture with his thumb, although you can make out the number a little on the box(if it's the matching box). That seems fishy to me. Music Direct has it marked down to $795(original version). I don't suppose you live near Milwaukee, do you? :-)
The Rega DAC from Music Direct is a better deal if you figure that you get a warranty for only $47 more than the Audiogon offer ($729 + $19 shipping vs $795 + free shipping).
I wasn't in any hurry to get the DAC so was willing to wait for a good deal on a used one or else wait for Music Direct to drop their price again once the new DAC-R had been on the streets a bit longer. That's assuming they have a bunch of the original DACs to clear out.
If nothing had come along in the next month I probably would have bought a new DAC from Music Direct even if the price hadn't dropped any further. You could always call them and see if they'd take another $50 off the price. You never know...
Tom
Ordered the DAC from Music Direct last night. :-) Hoping to have it before the weekend for some listening. I was ok with paying a few more bucks knowing i'm getting a brand new one. Can I use my Audioquest video coax cable for the connection? It's been hanging off of an old vcr for years.
I've been told that it's important to have a coaxial cable that's designed for 75 Ohms impedance to get the best sound; from what I've read, most decent video cables make good digital cables. But I don't have any experience other than the cable I bought specifically for the DAC.
Have fun experimenting with the DAC filters and let us know what you find. With any luck you'll be able to enjoy your digital music once again.
Tom
Got the Rega yesterday. Played it for a while and i'm not sure what i think. Ran the digital and the rca's out of my Rotel so i was able to switch back and forth with my preamp sources for the comparison. To me it sounds only a bit better, with more air and more definition, but nothing to make me excited to sit down and listen to my collection to enjoy the new sound. It also sounded a bit brighter. I went thru the filters and none of them really jumped out as helping the sound any.
I was expecting a larger difference, one like I've heard in the past when comparing my existing player to a higher level one. Granted, the player that sounded substantially better was an Audio Research CD2, but I would think a 20 yr old $700 player would have given up much more to a newer $1k DAC. I'll listen some more this weekend.
On a side note, I hooked up my Audio Research VT 60 after it sat in my closet for 5+ years and it's not working. The power light comes on for a second, then goes off. The four large tubes turn on and of the three small tubes, the left/right ones light up but the center one does not. I'm hoping that middle tube is the issue, and i don't replace it and have the new one do the same thing. I really don't know anything about tubes, other than they get warm when they're working and the can sound good.
I listened to a particularly harsh CD tonight and it didn't surprise me but the DAC didn't help with a really bad recording. The CD is The Pretenders - "The Singles" and it's just plain awful. At least the songs produced by Chris Thomas; the songs from "Get Close" are listenable.
Tom
I love that album! Actually i have it on vinyl and recorded my favorite few songs from there and put 'em right into itunes. I would have thought that would be a decent recording. I'll admit, 75% of my cd collection is 80's music and relatively speaking, i'm thinking the recordings are average or below compared to something considered 'audiophile'. I do however have a handful of gems on vinyl from that era that sound wonderful.
I did notice on my Rega that they built it with the standard socket for the power cable, making it possible to upgrade. I have not seen that connection anywhere in pictures of used ones I've come across, or even pictures of new ones on dealer's websites.
I have their early albums on vinyl and they're pretty good recordings but something was lost in translation to CD. So I'm going to buy "Get Close" on vinyl and give "The Singles" CD away. For some reason that particular CD really aggravates my tinnitus.
Interesting about the power connection on the DAC you got; I bought a C5 adapter and use a good 15 amp power cord with mine.
Regards,
Tom
I'm not surprised that you didn't hear a big difference if the Rotel was already providing a fairly good sound. It was the same for the difference between the Rega Apollo's internal DAC and the external DAC; it's not a night and day change. But subtle differences can be important, depending on what you're listening for, or depending on what your ears can hear.
I don't notice much difference in most of the music I play but there are certain CDs that I use as benchmarks of irritating digital sound where the Rega DAC makes a difference I can really hear. It's those CDs that I wanted to listen to without the irritating harshness and the DAC makes just enough difference for me to do so. I'm also finding that overall there's been an improvement, but it's taking some time to hear the difference. It's subtle, but it's there once I recognized it.
Give the DAC some time and perhaps you'll begin to notice those important differences.
Tom
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