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In Reply to: RE: Good question posted by jrdoe on December 02, 2016 at 19:37:19
I wouldn't know about $2 DACs. ;-)
But IMHO there's not much to be gained above about $1000 or so. I've heard DACs in that range and others that are significantly more expensive. $1000 - $2000 seems to be the sweet spot. Of course that's just my opinion.
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Hmmm. Set aside the choice of purely digital stuff in the DAC. For me, a critical part of any DAC is its analog output which is effectively a line stage
I don't find that line stage resolution capability tops out at the $1k level. At that price, you are most likely using op amps.
Pass.
Well, I generally agree that the output stage is probably overall more important than the DAC chip and filter but those are still rather critical.
For $1000 a Monarchy Audio NM24 will give you a pure tube output stage (no op amps...even for the IV) OR opamp output. It sounds as good as anything I have heard up to at least $5k. It uses the late great PCM1704 and DF1704 chipsets. The output is an SRPP design and sounds very good indeed.
I recently compared it to the $7500 Meitner MA-1 and the Resolution Audio Cantata (I have the M24, which has the older...and I think better...PCM63K but the rest is the same) and the Monarchy is in most ways better. The SS DACs have a bit deeper and stronger bass but they fall flat (literally) when it comes to soundstage and image palpability.
One of the differences is that a real linestage will likely have multiple analog inputs and connectors (RCA/XLR), input switching, versatile remote control, and cost associated with these features. A basic DAC can still have a good analog output stage but may delete all of the features and cost mentioned above.I agree that the DACs analog output stage plays a huge role in it's overall sound and I have to laugh to myself when folks put a too much emphasis on needing the latest greatest (or rare vintage) DAC 'chip' itself. The 'best' DAC chip is no guarantee that the DAC is going to sound great or even decent.
I'm sure there are excellent DACs out there for well over $2000 but in my own experience and opinion, one can get an outstanding DAC for much less these days. As with anything audio, higher performance and better sound are not always proportional to higher price. The magazine ratings and ranking systems will try to convince you otherwise. At least that has been the case for me in a number of comparisons not only with DACs but other gear as well.
Edits: 12/04/16
AbeCollins do you have your ps audio dsd dac connected by usb from source? I have a ps audio dac 3, and bought the dsd dac from psaudio and there was a nice improvement, I believe most came from the use of the Sabre chip. Unforuneately after 30 some days the unit quit in mid song. Called psaudio support, and was asked to change the fuse, which they sent to me. It worked on power up, so moved it back to system, connected it to usb input powered it up and fuse blew again. Sent back for refund. Usb still works on psaudio dac 3. Wondered if you had any problems with your unit.
No issues with mine. My PS Audio NuWave DSD DAC replaced the previous model NuWave. Mine was attached to my Mac Mini via USB for several months but it is now on the microRendu network streamer. It drives my Rogue Cronus Magnum or Ayre AX-7e integrated amps. I bought the NuWave DSD DAC when it first came out over a year ago.It does sound a little better than my previous unit and some of that improvement may be due to it's CPLD processing (similar to FPGA), Sabre DAC, and updated analog stage:
"The output stage is a unique Class-A configuration, fully balanced and direct coupled hybrid array (utilizing both discrete semiconductors and ICs), with an extended bandwidth of -3dB at 60 kHz!"
What was yours attached to? Were you running anything special for a USB cable? What linestage or amp was it driving?
In any case, the PS Audio NuWave DSD DAC sounds great, better than a few higher priced DACs that I owned in my system including the Wavelength Brick USB DAC v3 with Mortar PSU upgrade, Luxman DA-06, and the Ayre QB9-DSD. The Ayre and the NuWave DSD are very close sonically. Some may prefer the Ayre but I felt that the PS Audio was voiced more to my liking with a little more body and weight.
Edits: 12/04/16 12/04/16
Why have you had/have DSD capable Dacs?
I seem to recall that you don't care for DSD.
Why have you had/have DSD capable Dacs?
I seem to recall that you don't care for DSD.
Because many outstanding PCM DACs now INCLUDE DSD because if they didn't the manufacture would lose market share as many buyers think it's a must have feature. It's not that I dislike DSD, it's just that it's not important to me.
Was running either the pc or Sony media player by usb audioquest evergreen cable. All equipment was the same as used previously and using again with the returned previous dac. Outputing to a Feliks Elise headphone tube amp.
Not sure what to tell you unless perhaps there was some DC on the analog path somehow. The NuWave DSD DAC is direct coupled and not being familiar with your other gear it's just a bit of speculation on my part. All I know for certain is that I have never had any DAC blow a fuse and I've owned several. Who knows.
That was a first for me also. When I changed the fuse, the unit worked while not connected to any other gear. But as soon as I connected it to the usb cable the new fuse blew, even though nothing was powered up. Now with my original dac, same gear power cords,everything as it was, no problemso it had to be the dsd dac.What it was I could not say and they never offered an explanation. Such is life, thank you for your responses.
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