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d
Edits: 07/02/15 07/02/15 07/02/15 07/02/15 07/02/15 07/06/15Follow Ups:
Hi and thanks for disclosing your interesting experience.
- Which type of terminations/connectors did you use for the tests ?
- I guess the same ones for all cables ?
Thanks again.
Kind regards,
bg
Edits: 07/04/15
.
nt
You might want to try terminating it.
Ladder line has very very low loss through UHF (no dielectric is good dielectric) and a fairly large capture area. This can result in more RF at the power amplifier than it can handle (which is essentially none in most consumer products). Just terminate the speaker end or both with a resistor of the appropriate value and see if that improves things.
The characteristic impedance is likely to be high enough that you needn't worry about using a series capacitor to reduce in-band loss from the termination.
If you can't readily find the information on-line or on-shelf to determine your cable's charactoristic impedance describe the design and I'll try to help.
By the way, I use 300 ohm open wire interconnects in most places with good results. they are great for most applications, but terminating them is essential. Using masking tape for the spacer seems to work well...
Rick
We need more members to do this kind of thing.
Thanks for the unintentional proof that some cables DO need burn-in.
d
Edits: 07/03/15 07/03/15 07/06/15
A fool and his money may be soon parted, but a real fool is stuck with invalid opinions forever. A true sign of the times is that any person who chooses to post on the internet can be an "expert."
You have a lot to learn. I advise you to pay closer attention to those who know far more than you do and quit making posts containing snap judgments based on biased experiments.
There is inexpensive speaker cable that sounds excellent, but I think you haven't found it yet. You likely won't with the methodology you currently employ, and that's what invalidates your opinion for me.
Tom E
In your brief time here you seem to feel the need to instruct people who have been doing this longer then I suspect you've been alive. You might want to rethink that approach...
.
just a couple decades of hands-on experience. Do you remember trying Cobra Cable or Fulton Brown and Gold cables in your system?
Do you have the Duo-Tech Cable break-in box or the Audiodharma Cable Cooker at your place to play around with? (Which reminds me, I really need to get mine updated to the current revision. I just need 30 hours in a day!)
I thought so. Bye!
with his hands-on experience, that the Audioquest SLiP needs 150+ hours of burn-in, you are still holding to your first day's sonic impressions of this cable, from 3 days (or 70-some hours) ago.
Hmmm...
d
Edits: 07/02/15 07/02/15 07/06/15
coli wrote:
"Nope, it got worse actually"
That's an odd thing to say if you don't believe in cable burn-in. Apparently a brand new cable taken right off the spool sounds "fresher" to your ear. Perhaps there is a previously unknown phenomenon folks should be aware of...
Note: To be fair, sometimes the presentation of a brand new cable can go back in forth during the initial burn-in process, with a number of identifiable sonic artifacts to observe before more optimal burn-in time is achieved (including audible results of an intensive cable cooking process).
Since you are so closed minded towards something observable like the cable burn-in process, your low-cost speaker cable comparison has little credibility. You are obviously not interested in subtle micro level and not-so-subtle macro level audiophile listening cues. It's well known how important patience can be when it comes to the burn-in process, as well as the break-in process of loudspeakers and components, for that matter which includes internal wiring, not to mention capacitors which need plenty of burn-in time in order to perform at their best.
With such a plug-and-play mentality involved in the process, you said nothing insightful about your comparative cable evaluation. A worthlessly vague opinion of whatever you deem to be 'natural' sounding can't be much value to those who seek actual insights in regards to a comparative cable evaluation process. Much of what you described as 'colored' or 'weird' sounding was likely due in part to the lack of proper burn-in time provided for all of those brand new bloody cables you went on to disrespect out of spite. Think about it. Tossing something into an audio system while expecting to be impressed from the get-go is not a rewarding way to enjoy the audiophile journey, IME.
BTW, to take a poke at cable advocates in Cable Asylum like a knuckle-headed naysayer says more about you as an opinion maker than anything else. As far as people dismissing direct experimental evidence and trusting their beliefs instead, I've logged more time evaluating and experimenting through direct experience of various cables than you might imagine, without 'belief' involved in the evaluation process. Don't feel so free insult those who post in Cable Asylum.
Additionally, to accuse the cable industry of selling "horrible sound at expensive prices" is just another ignorant statement. Such a broad-brush accusation from someone such as yourself who has so little experience of the topic indicates nothing more than a foolish attitude. Pricey cables and connectors in my main audio system, as well as second systems deserve their extra expense. This is based on very dedicated, long-term experiences.
'nuff said
In the days before my colleagues and I acquired cable burn-in devices, that could happen.
In 1993-94, I purchased several identical 1-meter Kimber PBJ single-ended interconnects. With my Theta/Classe'/B&K/Muse/Adcom electronics, a fresh-out-of-the-bag PBJ could sound whiz-bang exciting. And then, after a couple of days, its sound would become a little duller and uninspiring. That is why we users needed to exercise patience, and wait a week or two longer, before the (non-treated) PBJ settled to a certain level.
Those same sort of changes took place, when we started using XLO Reference and Signature interconnects.
But, as anyone who has actually tried a cable burn-in device can tell you, NO amount of regular playing time equates to what a mere day on a burn-in device does.
It was really telling. In 2003, when we initially got an audiodharma Cable Cooker, we treated various 1-meter Kimber PBJs. We kept some pairs untreated, and then treated others, in 1-day, 2-day, 3-day, and 4-day increments. In this manner, we were able to discern the effects of the Cable Cooker.
Lo and behold, a Cooked (3 days) PBJ was less objectionable than an untreated Kimber KCAG with 10 years of regular use.
Indeed, though this Cable Cooker has undergone some upgrades, it's been in pretty much constant use, for 12 years. We are regularly using it, to Cook throwaway patchcords, speaker wire, video cables, and powercords - with amazing results. I'm currently reviewing Simaudio's Neo 260D CD player/DAC. For now, I've only had 6 different people inquire about the Neo 60D. But I've told all 6 that, before they mess around with after-market powercords, they first should get the OEM jobbie Cooked.
Apparently, the latest version of the Cable Cooker works better. That is, it takes less time to burn-in a cable, and does so without the telltale signs of over-Cooking: dull, slow, bloated, rolled-off sound. In his case, yes, an over-Cooked cable will sound worse, before it gets better, and reaches its resting plateau.
My Signal Cable speaker cables displaced Audioquest, Kimber and Anti Cables. Easily.
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