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I'm having an issue with the volume when I use my Classe CAP 101 integrated with a newly-purchased Sony HAP S1. I hope someone can help me understand what is going on. The Classe has 5 sets of RCA inputs (and one unbalanced set). It's volume control has a range of 0-50 in half-steps.
I have a Sony CA70ES cd player that I have used for years with the Classe, connecting its Line Out to the Classe's Reg1 input with a pair of "upmarket" Radio Shack interconnects. For as long as I have used it, my typical volume range has been 16-22, depending on time of day, music, my mood, etc. At my listening position, which is 7-8 feet from the speakers (Harbeth Monitor 30s), a sound meter app on my iPad reads roughly in the 50-62 db or so for that volume range. According to Sony, the output voltage for the CA70ES is 2 volts.
I connected of Line Out of my new Sony HAP S1 to the Classe Req2 input using a spare pair of very basic RCA interconnects. (To be clear, I'm not using the Sony's internal amplifier, and its volume is set at "Min" or zero.) To my surprise, the "usable" volume range for the HAP S1 reads on the Classe from 4.0 to 6.5, and most often at the lower end. Lower than 4.0, and it's too soft; higher than 6.5, and it's way too loud. According to Sony, the output voltage for the HAP S1 is 2.2 volts.
I think I lose a lot of flexibility in setting the volume when I use the HAP S1. I've tried everything I can think of to try to figure this out. I scoured the internet without success. I asked my dealer, but he had no clue. I contacted Sony Support, which tried to duplicate the issue but could not, and therefore told me that the problem was not in the HAP S1. I tried connecting the cd player to the Classe's Req2 and the HAP S1 to the amp's Req1, and I tried connecting the two sources to all the different inputs on the Classe, but I got the same results. And, I tried switching the interconnects, using the basic RCA with the CA70ES and the "upmarket" interconnect with the HAP S1, but again the same results.
Can anyone provide some insight as to what is going on and what, if anything, I can do about it? Thanks for reading and for your response.
Jim
Follow Ups:
I am wondering if the D/A output is meant to go to a sub's crossover, not an integrated amp.
Edits: 12/06/17
Who Knows Why Sony messed up.
Not a Hope they will acknowledge an error either. Notably; Sony is no longer the Maker it used to be.. A sunset business IMO.
First fit a wee pot (even a 1$ one will work Fine for this)
between Sony contraption and amp input (in interconnects).
Turn it till the volume level pleases.
Meter the resistance of that pot setting.
Fit an appropriate resistor inline into an interconnect. What ever brand you wish
(Noting that those who claim to hear/distinguish resistance sound qualities imo attend Star Trek conventions as well)
Job done
Edits: 12/06/17
same issue here. Sony s1 DA Direct Out, to NAD 326BEE (both new). Few room to adjust the volume.
Try the following setting:
Tone Bypass: On.
Volume Control: Auto. (useless to WAV/ DSD though).
Both of these not helping with the high voltage from the S1 DA Direct.
HOWEVER! Over the time of use (maybe one month or so), I found more room to turn the volume nob. Either the S1/ NAD are breaking in with each other.
Don't rush for a pre-amp or attenuator. More things you add on to the system, worst the sound ends up.
Get some Goldenjacks antenuators, they are the best quality and most transparent ones you can buy. You can even order them in whatever db values you want.
/
I'm not an owner, so I'm running off whatever's in the manual. You might want to check the following settings:
Tone bypass - on
DSEE - off
DSEE HX - off
Volume normalization - off
... if you haven't done so already.
If you don't use it, I don't see the point of having it.
I agree about Vol. Norm and Tone Bypass, tho, off.
I hope the OP let's us know how it's going...
Max out of the Sony cd player is 2 mv. But it is "variable" and you probably have it turned all the way down on your remote so no where near 2 mv. The Hap S1 is "fixed" out at 2 mv. If you turned your variable output on the Sony cd player all the way up you would find the same volume swing limits as the Hap.
Jonesy
"I know just enough to get into trouble. But not enough to get out of it."
Edits: 01/31/17
You might have to get an attenuator or a passive preamp to lower the volume on the Sony!
BCR,
Thanks for taking the time to respond. Do I understand correctly that you suggest putting the interconnect from the HAP S1 into a passive attenuator or into a passive pre-amp, either of which would then be connected to the Classe? I'll do some research into that.
Instead of introducing a separate variable attenuator unit, you might want to consider these simple In-Line one time voltage drop attenuators. Then you won't need extra sets of cables.
There are formulas on the net to calculate how many dB's you want to reduce the signal output on something like the Hap S1 2mV. The products are available in several choices.
The link will give you an example of in-line attenuators.
Note that anything you introduce into the signal path could compromise the sound quality, though a quick read of some reviews indicate an improvement. I am not familiar other than knowing these products exist.
Cheers!
Jonesy
"I know just enough to get into trouble. But not enough to get out of it."
JimC,
Yes,that's how you would do it!
adjust the integrated's volume pot accordingly.
DeKay,
Thanks for taking the time to respond. I tried this but it had no effect, likely because I'm not using HAP S1's amp.
I downloaded the manual for the HAP S1 and I couldn't find anything about its output voltage. Strange! All it said about the line outputs was that they had 2.2-killohms output impedance but there was no mention of output voltage. I suspect they have considerably higher output voltage than 2.2-volts full-scale.
I would recommend playing a test CD through the DAC and measure the output voltage with an AC voltmeter when playing a full-scale 1000-Hz test tone. You might find the HAP S1 has more like 4 or 5-volts at its line level outputs.
Good luck,
John Elison
John,
Thanks for taking the time to respond. Being functionally illiterate about a lot of electronics, I mistook the 2.2 kilohms in the specs for the output voltage. Do I understand your suggestion to be that I should load a test CD onto the HAP S1, disconnect the Line Out, play the 1000-khz test tone from the test CD, and measure the voltage at the line out? Guess I have to find a test CD and a voltmeter. :)
Jim
> Do I understand your suggestion to be that I should ..... measure the voltage at the line out?
If you want to know the maximum output voltage of your Sony HAP S1's fixed line-level output, you will need to send a full-scale 1000-Hz sinusoidal digital test signal into one of its DAC inputs and measure the voltage at its line-level analog output. Otherwise, contact Sony and see if they will tell you its output voltage specification.
On the other hand, if you think your Sony HAP S1 is defective, contact Sony for repair service.
Good luck,
John Elison
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