 
|
Audio Asylum Thread Printer Get a view of an entire thread on one page |
For Sale Ads |
|
|
Audio Asylum Thread Printer Get a view of an entire thread on one page |
For Sale Ads |
69.142.61.247
Once again I find myself preferring the lower end piece of a particular line. This time it's NAD. I bought myself a C275BEE out of frustration several years ago. Already having a NAD C326BEE I figured hey - more SHOULD be better????Well after two or three years of trying to get this amp to sound right I just gave up. I find myself CONTINUALLY rotating back in the amp section of the humble C326BEE. It just sounds tons better.
After looking at the schematic for the C275BEE I think I figured out why. It's like it was over engineered to death!
I also found this to be true with many of the vintage pieces I once collected. Pioneer, Sansui and even Marantz. Seems the more they try to "improve" or Impress???? the more they just gum up the sound. Their simpler pieces did sound far better.
charles
PS I will be getting my Latino ST-70 tomorrow. Yippie!!!!!!! A modern tube amp setup. I still love my Sherwood.
Edits: 08/16/15Follow Ups:
Looking at the schematic I noticed that amp board cap C111 is the first components and an electroylytic in the audio path. Also noting that it is the same series as all the others. So my little pea brain said HEY - why not replace that with an Audio grade electrolytic cap. So I cut away the outside casing of the cap, removed the "inners" and exposed the pin leads. To that I soldered on a Nichicon FW series lytic cap of the same value.The BEAN counters at NAD should be fired, beaten, shot, refired and then rebeaten and refired! For the lousy FRIGGIN 23 cents would it have killed them to put a damn decent cap IN THE FRIGGIN AUDIO PATH!!!!!!!!
Now I know where the midrange and midrange dynamics went to. The FRIGGIN bean counters at NAD put one cheap ass 16 cent cap in place of a 23 cent cap. I won't even mention the work non polar film WIMA. Lordy that would be an entire BUCK!!!!!
Edits: 08/20/15
I can understand the build.. by some Low bid maker in the East, fitting the cheapest parts he could sneak by.
But then You also retro fiited a Sub 25 Cent cap.. Why??
The Nichicon FW series is a good audio grade electrolytic cap. The original point was whey didn't THEY put that cap in. For the lousy 10 cent difference????
I will try a film cap next week after I check to make sure it is not filtering DC or something like that.
Which likely contributes to their dark house sound. Forgiving but somewhat opaque.
Mind you, I think they offer good value for the money although your observations suggest that a relatively modest boost in parts quality shouldn't cost that much more while improving its character.
Could be that your speakers aren't very demanding, and don't need the power. I've found many times that if power is not needed, a smaller, less powerful amp sounds better.
"I think I figured out why. It's like it was over engineered to death!"
Maybe. I used to design products with similar sensitivities as stereos and we had similar issues. You try to write performance specifications that insure satisfactory operation but they are just the minimum and in reality you do everything you can at design time to optimise the performance of each product given the constraints of time, budget, knowledge and luck. And sometimes you simply get a better turn on 'em thsn others. But they all meet Spec....
Here's some suggestions that might help if you can do them:
1. Avoid the early instances of new product releases. You don't really want to be an early adopter because there will usually be issues that show up in the first few production runs that simply didn't materialize at the prototype or pilot stages.
2. If you do a home audition and love the performance, buy that very unit! That's what I do. Sure, products with significant analog chunks ususally change a little with use ("burn-in") often for the better. But it's also true that while all of the parts (should) be in tolerance there are always measurable differences between them because their specifications have to be broad enough to allow adequate yield and most of their performance is predicated on build (SPC) rather than individual verification. Why take a chance?
3. Try some of the audiophilish tweaks during evaluation. Dig out some different signal cables and try snapping a Z-bead on the power cord (if your religion allows it). Sometimes devices just need a little help to play nicely with other boxes in your system.
Good luck... (isn't that always part of it?)
Rick
... for a second there I thought it will continue with "If the piece of gear responds to those in any way, send it back ASAP where it came from".
Sure glad I was wrong this time.
Me too... It is refreshing occasionally, isn't it?
R.
> > 2. If you do a home audition and love the performance, buy that very unit! ... Why take a chance?
Amen to that. I auditioned and LOVED an Art Audio phono stage. After
sending it along to another reviewer, I ordered one for myself. Didn't
sound nearly as good as the one I fed forward. Never again will I do that.
Which brings us to the problem you state:
> > But it's also true that while all of the parts (should) be in tolerance there are always measurable differences
I can't say the differences would have been measurable, but they were
certainly audible (and disconcerting!). So much so that I sent the
second unit back.
If you don't become the ocean, you'll be seasick every day.
- Leonard Cohen
I'm no engineer, but when I see a amplifier schematic that complex it only appears to mean one thing to me. They were compensating for various problems that they just couldn't get the damn thing right. Or they were shooting for the "spec number" regardless of the sonic cost.
Don't get me wrong. this amp isn't a pig. but it sure doesn't rank well either. If a company is putting this out as their premium amp, then they should be embarrassed. There are a lot of audio companies with a lot of very fine economical gear available. Don't piss off those that have been faithful to your company. But heck that does seem to be today's business model anyway.
charles
I love CJ pre-amps.
I've purchased a LOT of audio gear. New, used, vintage, cheap, expensive, what ever! And that CJ Classic 2SE is one of the finest pieces I have ever owned. This is why I want to build the Latino ST-70 to pair with it. It deserves something nice. Right now I am using a NAD C326BEE amp section. Don't be fooled by the price. This is one FINE cheap ass amp!!!!
My other prize piece is my fully restored Sherwood S-5000.
Both are very dear to my heart when it comes to audio.
And oh yeah - my ST-70 arrives TODAY!!! But I'll need a few hours to put it together.
charles
Get cracking Charles and take pics. I can't wait to read about your new toy.
Meat; It's the right thing to do. Romans 14:2
It's still sitting in the box in the basement work area. I'll be opening it up today!!!!!!!!!!!!
Started it today. Pics to post soon.
More parts than I remembered!!!
And I forgot just how heavy that iron really was. WOW those are some serious trannies.
charles
along with Jon Curl. Charles Hanson, Nelson Pass and a host of others (if not Bruno Putzeys) that simple circuits sound more like live, unamplfiied music. :)
Since both are integrated amps connect the re out of each to the main in of the other one at a time and compare again. The "sound" of an integrated comes more from its pre amp section than power amp section. Could have an interesting result. If you have a tube pre laying around try it into both. I never cared for NAD preamp sections very much.
E
T
The 275 is a separate power amp. The 326 is a basic integrated amp.
I'm using a $2500 CJ preamp on a $400 amp.
That splains why hi-fi engine only had one of them in integrated amps......
E
T
Post a Followup:
| FAQ |
Post a Message! |
Forgot Password? |
|
||||||||||||||
|
||||||||||||||
This post is made possible by the generous support of people like you and our sponsors:
Top of Page ]
[ Contact Us ]
[ Support/Wish List ]
[ Copyright © 2024, Audio Asylum, all rights reserved ]
